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Chockstone Forum - General Discussion
General Climbing Discussion
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6:26:47 PM |
On 15/04/2010 nmonteith wrote: >On 15/04/2010 gordoste wrote: >>No that will only happen when Discovery channel decide to make a climbing >>film. Which climbers will all agree is crap and go back to watching Dosage >>9. > >It's a fine line. They have now started playing some of the Dosage videos >on free to air TV (One on the digital dial) - so they already have 'mainstream' >appeal it seems. Really? Why didnt I know about this?!?!? Someone should tell me when climbing movies are on. Im assuming its one One HD, as this was the channel that showed King Lines? |
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9:57:30 PM |
Yeah they've shown a few, I think King Lines has been on 3 or 4 times now. | |||||
10:07:25 PM |
well, if somebody offered me money to sky dive into a crag and have my food and climbing gear waiting for me i am pretty sure that i wouldn't argue... |
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12:02:47 PM |
On 15/04/2010 nmonteith wrote: >It's a fine line. They have now started playing some of the Dosage videos >on free to air TV (One on the digital dial) - so they already have 'mainstream' >appeal it seems. Yes and a good thing too... the climbing community of Albury Wodonga was 3 people until they showed that. A couple of guys saw it and thought it looked cool so they went and bought some climbing shoes and started bouldering. One day we ran into them at the crag and now we climb together quite often. Of course they pretty soon realised that there are no crazy DWS arches around here but that didn't make much difference. So I am all in favour of promotion of climbing! Now I just need to teach them that roped climbing is even more fun. I'm pretty sure they don't know that trad even exists. |
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8:34:17 PM |
On 16/04/2010 gordoste wrote: >Now I just need to teach them that roped climbing >is even more fun. I'm pretty sure they don't know that trad even exists. ... ~> & then they can progress to real rope jiggery pokery and do aid! Heh, heh, heh. |
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10:03:34 AM |
On 15/04/2010 nmonteith wrote: >On 15/04/2010 MonkeyBoy wrote: >>If you check out the photos on the site below it shows them prepping >and >>dropping loads of gear - > >Holy calamity! This really is all very unnecessary. The walk in isn't >too bad, 4 to 5 days if you walk all the way from town, or at most 3 if >you get a lift on a skidoo up the frozen fjord (or a boat when it thaws >out) - how much crap do you need to free a rock route?? And I wonder how >they got all those barrels back out again? > With all the f--- ups just trying to get the gear there with the method you suggested, I think dropping it in was ingenious, especially how they had to get special permission from the national park. It's all quite a feat. Before the movie was released I went to one of leo's lectures, and he really discussed a lot of the behind behind the scenes stuff, like all the reall c--k ups with the deliveries, and organising the trip/training. I have muchos deep respect for this movie, and those boys. |
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9:51:59 PM |
Having actually been on this outing (and on six trips to Auyuittuq) I feel both qualified and obligated to comment. I'll strive for brevity. First of all, Tall Poppy Syndrome nears the top of my list of the most distasteful things about Australia. I'll spare you all the diatribe and leave it at that. Lazy buggers? Ha! Come back when you're free climbing 5.13 in subzero temps staring down potential 60 footers. And lets not forget that the logistics of making a groundbreaking film, with a team of seven, on a remote mountain are actually rather complex and requires quite a lot of gear. On that note, not everybody has the time (or the timing) to spend 3 weeks or more (the Belgians took 4 weeks to get to Asgard, two climbs along the way) humping loads. Neil, it's not 4 days from town, especially if you're humping wall gear; if you totally bust your ass you can make it from Overlord to Asgard north side base camp in 3 days, right before you collapse and vomit. The town to Overlord leg is actually a hideous tundra slog and not at all like the lovely trail in the rest of the valley. Actually, the reason they were even doing an airdrop is that the park service changed the rules for stashing gear without telling them. Two days after Charlie skidooed their gear in Parks flew in with a helicopter and took it all back to town. That in itself is the very reason they got special permission to fly a chartered plane in to begin with. Leo and team had no idea they were going to jump out of the plane until they showed up in Pang and the pilot suggested it to them; after which they got a bit nervous and wrote up a quick disclaimer on a piece of paper. And no, actually the point wasn't to have the tents set up and coffee waiting for when the rest of the team showed up. In reality soon after they landed we turned around and ran 16k over six hours down to Summit Lake, found the radio broken, slept for a few hours before and Leo and I then ran another 15k down the valley to meet the team. So rest assured we got plenty of hiking in. Wallwombat, here's an idea: why don't you exploit the fantastic mechanisms of the free market and NOT buy their film, simultaneously casting your vote of extreme distaste and preserving personal funds to aid in removing your own felt uneasiness and approaching that elusive state of Epicurian ataraxia? Charlie also picked up the gear they didn't carry out at the end of the trip. Inuit eyes go as big as saucers over free ropes, tarps, barrels, food, etc.- but he still got paid. If anyone in Melbourne is super keen on the film I might be inclined to loan it to you, or the Belgian's film for that matter (Asgard Jamming). |
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10:28:10 PM |
Thanks for your reply Jason! Sounds a lot more interesting hearing the real background story - more disorganized and exciting than I imagined! On 19/04/2010 singersmith wrote: > On that note, not everybody has the time (or the timing) to spend 3 weeks >or more (the Belgians took 4 weeks to get to Asgard, two climbs along the >way) humping loads. Neil, it's not 4 days from town, especially if you're >humping wall gear; if you totally bust your ass you can make it from Overlord >to Asgard north side base camp in 3 days, right before you collapse and >vomit. We did double loads in haul bags from Overlord to Asgard base and it took 5 days. That was lumping all our own wall gear and food for our 7 week trip. We then dragged it all out again at the end. It certainly takes a lot less than 4 weeks. We did abandon gear all along the walk as our shoulders exploded and we decided we really didn't need everything we had brought. :-) My favorite item of uselessness was spare batteries for my head torch! I think I used it once to look inside the bottom of my haul bag when it was in a stash cave. >The town to Overlord leg is actually a hideous tundra slog and not >at all like the lovely trail in the rest of the valley. errr not when I did it? It was a delightful 1 day flat walk with a bit of a river wade at one point. Funny story actually when i did this - I didn't own a watch and did this walk by myself, so i was trying to work out when to eat, sleep and walk. I 'thought' I had taken 2 days, but when I arrived in town they told me I had only taken 24 hours!! Ha ha - 24 sun is a mind bending experience. |
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12:03:57 PM |
Leo was actually well organized, except for timing because someone had to be at a wedding; they should have been 3 weeks earlier. >We did double loads in haul bags from Overlord to Asgard base and it took >5 days. That was lumping all our own wall gear and food for our 7 week >trip. We then dragged it all out again at the end. Which Asgard base? Up the Caribou or up the Turner? They are quite different affairs. Here on Chockstone you're quoted as calling your trip 5 weeks. Did you shuttle two loads, or run one in and come back? If you got set up at basecamp in 5 days what did you do for the next 6 weeks? Which walls/faces and how long did you camp on them? And again, we're talking about not just big wall gear for 6 (although one bailed, plus one photographer in basecamp) but also video cameras, lenses, batteries, solar panels, tripods (these things weighed a ton), parachutes, computers, sat phone and 15 year bottles of Glenfiddich. >>The town to Overlord leg is actually a hideous tundra slog and not >>at all like the lovely trail in the rest of the valley. >errr not when I did it? It was a delightful 1 day flat walk with a bit >of a river wade at one point. Your talk (and video) of skidooing in, as well as your video/images, indicate that your trip was in early season (maybe May/June?) when any exposed tundra is firm, there is ice/snow to walk on (especially at the waterside), and the rivers are a trickle. In fact, the only reason to walk from town, other than to save 100 bucks, is because a boat can't get in because of the ice. The rivers change dramatically over the course of the season (and in peak melt off, over the course of the day) and suck quite a bit of time when you can't go splashing through in gaiters and have to take off your pants and ford every now and again. The bridge at Windy Lake has also washed out so you can't use that side of the river (with the trail) unless you're going to swim the Weasel like Sean did, which was a horrifying sight indeed. |
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12:27:17 PM |
Haha nice one Singer... I figured that the video didn't tell the full story because I have a lot of respect for the people involved in that expedition and I was pretty sure they wouldn't take shortcuts without a good reason. Way to dish out some STFU! At the end of the day though, anyone heading into those areas is going to be doing something pretty amazing. Let's not get carried away in working out who carried what where and how long it took them... everyone's achievements stand well enough on their own without needing to be constantly compared. |
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1:24:14 PM |
> everyone's achievements >stand well enough on their own without needing to be constantly compared. Nice one Gordoste I was thinking a similar thing but couldn't really figure out how to get it into words. I think its pretty unbelievable any one gets out there on foot at all after looking up where it is on google maps. Singer - Thanks for offering a bit of insight into the trip from a personal perspective, it must have been amazing thing to be part of. |
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2:05:05 PM |
I'm not going to get dragged into a pissing match about what we climbed ect... Obviously the 'scale' of our simple trip was much smaller than yours and the routes we did lamer. On 20/04/2010 singersmith wrote: >Which Asgard base? Up the Caribou or up the Turner? They are quite different >affairs. I can't remember! We just climbed the 'tourist route' up Asgard so camped up near the approach to that. It involved horrendous soft snow up the glacier to get to the mtn itself. We wished we had skiis or at least snow shoes! We ended up rolling on our sides to make progress so we didn't sink past our necks in snow. Funny. >Here on Chockstone you're quoted as calling your trip 5 weeks. > Did you shuttle two loads, or run one in and come back? We walked one load in, then walked back down the same day and camped then did it all again the next day with a 2nd load. We left caches of food and fuel up the valley so by the time we got to near Asgard we could lug in our equipment in one load rather than two. It took us 5 days. By the end of the week we had summited Asgard. >If you got set >up at basecamp in 5 days what did you do for the next 6 weeks? Asgard by the tourist route, free climbed 20 or so pitches up the slabby buttress on the left edge of Thor and did 10 or so pitches of a new aid route on Tirokowa. Plus sat out horrible winds and did a fair bit of exploratory walking as well. >Your talk (and video) of skidooing in, as well as your video/images, indicate >that your trip was in early season (maybe May/June?) when any exposed tundra >is firm, there is ice/snow to walk on (especially at the waterside), and >the rivers are a trickle. In fact, the only reason to walk from town, >other than to save 100 bucks, is because a boat can't get in because of >the ice. The rivers change dramatically over the course of the season >(and in peak melt off, over the course of the day) and suck quite a bit >of time when you can't go splashing through in gaiters and have to take >off your pants and ford every now and again. When we arrived it was during the start of ice break up - our skidoo got us most of the way to the end of fiord but we still had to lug it a few kilometres across the ice to reach land. We were there in June, so by the end of 5 weeks ALL the snow and ice was long gone in the valley and in the fiord. The rivers were raging and the tundra was squishy soft. So we got to experience both sides environments! It was actually really cool seeing such dramatic changes in such a short period of time. Trying to get over the river from Thor was dodgy as when it was half melting ice and raging water. My biggest regret was not bringing a 2nd set of shoes. I walked back to town not to save $100, but because I had the time to kill and I enjoy walking. My partner took the boat as he had sprained his ankle. >The bridge at Windy Lake >has also washed out so you can't use that side of the river (with the trail) >unless you're going to swim the Weasel like Sean did, which was a horrifying >sight indeed. Sounds damn scary! :-) |
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3:01:14 PM |
On 20/04/2010 gordoste wrote: >At the end of the day though, anyone heading into those areas is going >to be doing something pretty amazing. Let's not get carried away in working >out who carried what where and how long it took them... everyone's achievements >stand well enough on their own without needing to be constantly compared. Ignoring this particular case for a minute, that is absolute rubbish. Style is important. |
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3:48:51 PM |
On 20/04/2010 Duncan wrote: >Ignoring this particular case for a minute, that is absolute rubbish. > Style is important. Hear hear! And the sooner the 80s come back, the better I say! |
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3:56:20 PM |
On 19/04/2010 singersmith wrote: >First of all, Tall Poppy Syndrome nears the top of my list of the most >distasteful things about Australia. I'll spare you all the diatribe and >leave it at that. > I'm quite surprised to hear you say that mate.....would've thought that mass marketing and hero worship would be way less compatable with your style than a little sniping at the "world famous leading climbers" The general acceptance of grade based pecking orders was one of the things which shat me the most about climbing in North America. >Lazy buggers? Ha! Come back when you're free climbing 5.13 in subzero >temps staring down potential 60 footers. And lets not forget that the >logistics of making a groundbreaking film, with a team of seven, on a remote >mountain are actually rather complex and requires quite a lot of gear. I'm not suggesting that it wasn't a cool adventure, no doubt it was stacks of fun being out there, but watching a movie of someone elses adventures makes me feel left out. (much like the dudes who insist on writing a 3 page trip report on chocky for EVERY w/e they hit the rock.......having a good time on a 3 pitch route in the blueys is not sufficient material for a readable story!!!) Anyway Singer, what's with all this 'climbing on rock' crap? I didn't think you pulled onto anything anymore unless it was 2 foot wide and totally vegetated?! |
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5:02:17 PM |
>I'm quite surprised to hear you say that mate.....would've thought that >mass marketing and hero worship would be way less compatable with your >style than a little sniping at the "world famous leading climbers" I'm talking more about constantly being told about the things I can't do, am not capable of, or will never pull off. General negativity toward dreaming, scheming, and positive visualization. I frown on anyone sniping at Leo because he's one of my best friends and one of the most gentlemanly people I know. Neil, wasn't trying to start a pissing match; just shutting down internet slander. I'm sorry if you took offense. I wasn't there to get rad, I was there to hang out with my friends and do another lap up the Scott Route - which it sounds like you did as well. It's awesome, huh? I was actually a full hitchhiker, showing up unannounced and without food or climbing gear, ha!. Long story, but I felt left out after they all e-mailed me for beta so I just showed up, beat them to base camp, and joined their trip, gambling that 12 people would have extra food for me. No one was more surprised than I was to watch 3 bodies huck out of the plane. Had you asked me, I would have told you to stay off that buttress of Thor. It's the single most dangerous part of the whole valley, both sides of the valley right there in a short section shed massive amounts of rockfall on a regular basis. One Day Hero, I'm out of retirement (look out below), more of a 6-9 inches kind of guy, and vegetation keeps the riff raff away. |
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5:35:49 PM |
On 20/04/2010 singersmith wrote: >Had you asked me, I would have told you to stay off that buttress of Thor. > It's the single most dangerous part of the whole valley, both sides of >the valley right there in a short section shed massive amounts of rockfall >on a regular basis. I watched in abject terror as several large house sized blocks pitched off the top of the steep wall of Thor whilst we were on that side buttress. There was so much loose crap lying around on ledges it was really a situation of onwards and upward - no retreat! I wouldn't have dared to rig ropes and try and rap off - we would have taken half the cliff down with us. Actually when we were first dropped off from the skidoos and were trying to get our bearing we had a massive rockfall happen right above the fiord. It felt so close we literally dropped our bags and made a run for it - lucky for us it stopped several hundred metres up the hill. It was quite an introduction to the area! |
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8:48:15 AM |
This has been a really informative/brilliant read. Singer, I thank you so much for re-clarifying. It's a funny thing when you've heard it all from some of the team at their lectures, but to read it all again, after you've seen the feat of a feature film, you can't but appreciate the genius behind it. On 20/04/2010 singersmith wrote: > I frown on anyone sniping >at Leo because he's one of my best friends and one of the most gentlemanly >people I know I've only met him a couple times, and a few people I work with know him very well, but he's been so friendly. I don't understand why people get all 'Oh it's the leo houlding show' about him. I really admire him, I hear stories about how he used to work in the local pub, and would have a boulder for his lunch breaks, and then maybe not return back to work. I think it's brilliant. Anywho, Who's actually seem the movie? |
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9:03:47 AM |
I thought I should so I have got a copy on its way from the UK. Not here yet though. | |||||
9:07:56 AM |
On 21/04/2010 Musique wrote: >all 'Oh it's the leo houlding show' about him. I think the bit he did on Top Gear did him a huge disservice. I watched it and thought "What a f---ing tool"... Other things I've seem him in he doesn't come across like that at all... |
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