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Tiger Wall - Dribble Bolting?

kieranl

21-Aug-2009
5:38:33 PM

On 21/08/2009 One Day Hero wrote:
>
>But I've said all of that before and Kierans drill continues to whirr.
>I don't think pulling his bolts out will stop him but talking has achieved
>nothing so chopping is the next thing to try.
I didn't see this comment before. Has One Day Hero got my drill? I thought it was sitting unused in the garage.

kieranl

21-Aug-2009
5:56:11 PM

If you put bolts in you have to be prepared to cop it if someone takes them out because the think you've overstepped the mark. But I really can't stomach someone coming from interstate on an occasional visit and imposing their will.

Hermes

21-Aug-2009
7:29:18 PM

One day hero wrote:
"I fully support the erosion control measures such as steps in gullys etc. "

I think we've missed the big issue here guys. Why are we sitting here quibbling about tiny pieces of metal in the rocks when people out there are pouring concrete in our gullies and building large unsightly piles of rock on the side of tracks? I for one will be bringing a jackhammer next time i visit the crag rather than an angle grinder. Get serious guys!! :-P

gtempest

21-Aug-2009
8:58:48 PM

Just a few points I'd like to make:

1. Noddy and Ed Neve had a good concept in the mid 1970s (a direct route up the right side of Tiger Wall) but the Dribble was a fairly worthless route in its original state. It was covered in moss had heaps of loose rock and was - understandably - quickly forgotten.

2. During the research and re-shooting of images required for the second edition of Arapiles Selected Climbs Simon and I discussed the possibility of resurrecting a route or two on the right side of Tiger Wall. On the day we straightened out Deathwatch Beetle Simon told me that he had done the Dribble a couple of times recently and that somewhere under the mank was a good route waiting to be discovered. He came back on a bunch of other occasions, cleaning up the route, knocking off all the loose rock and working out the best way for people to enjoy it. Finally he told me that it was definitely worth adding to our Selected Climbs guide but that he'd decided to place two bolts at the top of the third pitch. His reasoning was that except for that particular belay the route had excellent gear which as easy to place. I distinctly remember him saying that it was a fiddly belay (for grade 11 climbers) and out of character with the rest of the route. Since I've known Simon I've come to respect his judgment when it comes to such matters. I don't think I've ever met anyone in all my years of tying into a rope that is so pedantic about belay setups or general safety. I've also seen the tragic results of less experienced climbers using a 'fiddly belay' that failed and it isn't a pretty sight. As far as I know Noddy had no objections and I certainly didn't feel that two bolts on the third belay of the Dribble was any big deal in the scheme of things, especially since Arapiles would now have another classic climb which would help redirect ever-increasing climber numbers off Syrinx and The Eighth.

3. In a nutshell. We now have a really good 120m route up Tiger Wall that grade 11 climbers can thoroughly and safely enjoy themselves on. Simon put a lot of work and energy into getting that route ready for the guide and with no real credit. Simon does not place bolts on a whim and I know he thought carefully about it.

4. There are far worse transgressions I can think of than two bolts on the third belay of the Dribble and I don't think Arapiles has suddenly become any less a crag for it.

5. However, I do think that discussions such as these are valuable and are especially important to anyone considering placing bolts (particularly those new to climbing). The real message here is that ANY bolt placed should be carefully considered as it may well be questioned. And isn't that the way it should be?

Glenn


howzithanging?

21-Aug-2009
10:13:47 PM

AND THATS THE END OF THAT CHAPTER


Sarah Gara

22-Aug-2009
5:19:33 PM

I BLOODY HOPE SO.

Cheers Glen x


IdratherbeclimbingM9

22-Aug-2009
9:23:49 PM

On 21/08/2009 howzithanging? wrote:
>AND THATS THE END OF THAT CHAPTER

~> till the next ^ post came along!


Sarah Gara

23-Aug-2009
10:01:33 AM

I always have to have the last word! eek! x


miguel75

23-Aug-2009
3:30:01 PM

Me too.


rodw

23-Aug-2009
6:12:46 PM

Not me.

Trent Williams

23-Aug-2009
7:20:09 PM

Glenn's post would have to be the most logical and concise post in this thread. Well done.

jimfalla

24-Aug-2009
1:22:38 PM

Logical and concise does not make it right. Retro bolting is wrong.


nmonteith

24-Aug-2009
1:24:51 PM

This is like Bold and the Beautiful... you miss a few years worth of episodes, tune back in and its the same plot line still being dragged out...


IdratherbeclimbingM9

24-Aug-2009
1:33:53 PM

On 24/08/2009 nmonteith wrote:
>This is like Bold and the Beautiful... you miss a few years worth of episodes,
>tune back in and its the same plot line still being dragged out...

Shame on you nm! That is no way to talk about simeys cafe!
Heh, heh, heh.
☺

drdeviousii

24-Aug-2009
2:28:26 PM

your all carrying on like a bunch of f---ing queenslanders. going cane toad hunting tonight?


mattjr

24-Aug-2009
4:21:18 PM

On 21/08/2009 howzithanging? wrote:
>AND THATS THE END OF THAT CHAPTER

brendan

24-Aug-2009
7:47:15 PM

so just to ease everyones mind, roberstonja (jason) is not a bolt nazi we have been in the Blue mountains for the last 3 days and have had fun climbing and clipping bolts, however that is the blue mountains, and every area has there own ethics and i think this is where the intial problem is. Jason is not complaining about someone painting numbers on a boulder in Fontainebleu or bolting a climb in Nowra, he is complaining about someone bolting a belay in a traditional climbing area, he obviously feels pissed off as someone has taken it upon themselves to bolt a belay on a trad route that was not bolted on the first ascent, the route sounds like a peice of shit anyway. Its the principal, just like when Robert McMahon & Gerry Narkowicz chopped there own abseil anchor on Ben Lomond to prove a principal about not bolting on Ben Lomond, if the belay was fiddly and gear hard to find when he was preparing the route for the guidebook maybe he should have included that in the guidebook, at the end of the day i don't really care, i just want araplies to be a trad cliff with strong ethics, look at the UK they have tiny little cliffs that are not world class but there ethics are what makes the place what it is, its the principle of the debate not the actual climb or bolts

tastybigmac

24-Aug-2009
8:39:01 PM

get over yourselves. as i said before this whole thread is a load of bullshit.

simey

24-Aug-2009
9:07:27 PM

Brendan,
Look forward to reading what you have to say once you have a better understanding of the history, development, ethics and enviromental concerns of various cliffs and climbs.

brendan

24-Aug-2009
9:35:45 PM

On 24/08/2009 simey wrote:
>Brendan,
>Look forward to reading what you have to say once you have a better understanding
>of the history, development, ethics and enviromental concerns of various
>cliffs and climbs.

sorry are you talking about araplies or about various cliffs

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