Chockstone Forum

      Sponsored By
      ROCK
   HARDWARE

Chockstone Photography

Australian Landscape Prints

Chockstone Forum - General Discussion

General Climbing Discussion

Author

Common Courtesy at Indoor Gyms


BigMike

3-May-2006
12:16:49 PM

Glad you agree. One almost wishes it would be a posted rule for busy times, or at least a posted guideline. After all, in many general fitness gyms there are regulations concerning use of cardio machines during peak times.

I always love the look of indignation on a new climbing partner when they find themselves heading earthwards after hang number three :-)


IdratherbeclimbingM9

3-May-2006
12:26:38 PM

Hereyago gymbunnies. This is your chance to educateafossil.

This is not a troll, though I am aware that it could ruin my reputation ...

Having never set foot in a climbing gym before I may give it a shot when I visit Canberra soon.
[Am always open to new climbing experiences :)]

What is the likelihood of getting a belay if I turn up mid week within 9-5 type business hours? ... as it would be a bummer to arrive with harness, shoes, belay device, pay money and then sit around waiting*. I gather (perhaps incorrectly) from other threads that many people attend these places after work ...

(*... I don't imagine they would let me use a Silent Partner self belay device if no-one else is available!).

On the topic of belay device. Do gyms have a mandatory grigri ethic/rule or can I use my trusty sticht plate?

Any replies welcome as I figure I can sort chaffe from wheat (sometimes; heh, heh, heh).
M9


brat

3-May-2006
12:58:44 PM

I loved the gym in Canberra, boxing bag to warm up on (spun everyone out punching the crap out of it), home made belay device and a HUGE roof full of routes!

You may want to take a belayer, it wasn't very busy the couple of times I've been there, and possibly the coldest place I've ever been in, wore my coat climbing!


Sabu

3-May-2006
1:01:27 PM

On 3/05/2006 M9iswhereitsat wrote:
>Hereyago gymbunnies. This is your chance to educateafossil.
damn fossils....

>This is not a troll, though I am aware that it could ruin my reputation
it already has !!

>Having never set foot in a climbing gym before I may give it a shot when
>I visit Canberra soon.
>[Am always open to new climbing experiences :)]
a possible new addiction?? :P

>What is the likelihood of getting a belay if I turn up mid week within
>9-5 type business hours? ... as it would be a bummer to arrive with harness,
>shoes, belay device, pay money and then sit around waiting*. I gather (perhaps
>incorrectly) from other threads that many people attend these places after
>work ...
if it's anything like hardrock you chances aren't good. best try the evenings!

>(*... I don't imagine they woould let me use a Silent Partner self belay
>device if no-one else is available!).
no but it's worth a try for a laugh!!

>On the topic of belay device. Do gyms have a mandatory grigri ethic/rule
>or can I use my trusty sticht plate?
they usually have belay devices already anchored to the floor. all you have to do is clip into it. if ur leading u can use ur trusty stitchplate.

>Any replies welcome as I figure I can sort chaff from wheat (sometimes;
>heh, heh, heh).
>M9
hope that helped .... sorta !!
Sabu


nmonteith

3-May-2006
1:47:58 PM

On 3/05/2006 M9iswhereitsat wrote:
>On the topic of belay device. Do gyms have a mandatory grigri ethic/rule
>or can I use my trusty sticht plate?

Some gyms won't let you use particular belay devices for leading. For instance Hardrock only allows
Stitch Plates (or ATC type devices). Gri Gri's have been banned for some stupid reason. At Cliffhanger
you get tested and approved for your chosen belay device - and this is marked on your lead card.


IdratherbeclimbingM9

3-May-2006
2:26:32 PM

On another thread billk wrote:
>Khorp khun khrap brat.
& on this thread brat wote
>(spun everyone out punching the crap out of it),

Hmmmm.

~~~~~~~~~

Thanks Sabu, brat & nmonteith for your replies.

>a possible new addiction??
Not likely. Too far to travel and I suspect the boredom factor would set in too early.

Re leading; Does one use their own rope or does the gym supply it ?

Re
>they usually have belay devices already anchored to the floor. all you have to do is clip into it
Is this just a sling with a captive belay device? Do I need to take a few locking krabs also?
... am already feeling queer contemplating climbing in a gym let alone taking unnecessary gear!


nmonteith

3-May-2006
2:41:32 PM

On 3/05/2006 M9iswhereitsat wrote:
>Re leading; Does one use their own rope or does the gym supply it ?

Your own rope and belay device is required for gym leading. Quickdraws are already installed on the
bolts. If you are only toproping then the gym supplies the rope and belay device. 90% of people in the
gym are only top-roping. In fact many routes will not have bolts/quickdraws for leading.

>Is this just a sling with a captive belay device? Do I need to take a
>few locking krabs also?

Yep sling fixed to floor anchor with belay device in place. Bringing a few locking biners will be useful
for attachment to harness.


cruze

3-May-2006
3:26:41 PM

The only lead route at Mitchell, Canberra is the massive 20m roof. Rope and belay device supplied (must give quick nudge nudge wink wink I can belay a leader deal with staff - who will have climbed outdoors about 10 times in their lives). Plenty of fixed draws. Chris Webb used to spend a solid session bouldering in the v. steep caves then warm down by traversing the roof, backclimbing roof then climbing out again. I read somewhere he reckoned it was around 27 to do it once (fortunately it starts easier). Rest is TR. Need one locking biner. One Harness.

I saw your post re being in the Berra this weekend earlier M9. Still not sure what I am doing this weekend but I usually climb with my GF. Will let you know.


billk

3-May-2006
3:28:50 PM

On 3/05/2006 M9iswhereitsat wrote:
>On another thread billk wrote:
>>Khorp khun khrap brat.
>& on this thread brat wote
>>(spun everyone out punching the crap out of it),
>
>Hmmmm.
>
; )

All chockstoners planning on going climbing in Thailand have gotta learn to hear the male polite particle (khrap) without sniggering. Thais coming here have to learn to hear "yet" (f--- in Thai) without sniggering and they have to get used to the very worst insult in Thai being the name of the world's biggest furniture chain store.

BTW While I'm here on this thread, does anyone have an explanation for all the belay devices and harnesses no longer permitted at Hardrock?


Phil Box

3-May-2006
4:46:45 PM

M9, to retain your hardman trad status you must definitely take your hexes with you and wear them with pride as they clink by your side as you pull on the green climbs. Having lots of clinky bits will confirm your hardman status to all the gymbies at the indoor gym. Let us know how you get on with the chicks too mate, you'll score for sure. ;))

PS, don't forget the ham sammies and the flanelette shirt.

PPS, don't hit me for being a smart alec.

Phil...


belayslave

3-May-2006
4:58:43 PM

On 3/05/2006 billk wrote:
>BTW While I'm here on this thread, does anyone have an explanation for
>all the belay devices and harnesses no longer permitted at Hardrock?

In short - Insurance.
The company has advised that they will no longer cover for the use of grigri's and other such 'auto-locking'
belay devices, along with some other older style belay devices/methods.


billk

3-May-2006
5:15:01 PM

On 3/05/2006 belayslave wrote:
>On 3/05/2006 billk wrote:
>>BTW While I'm here on this thread, does anyone have an explanation for
>>all the belay devices and harnesses no longer permitted at Hardrock?
>
>In short - Insurance.
>The company has advised that they will no longer cover for the use of
>grigri's and other such 'auto-locking'
>belay devices, along with some other older style belay devices/methods.

I will have another look at what's on their list next time I'm there to see whether it makes sense or not.

I'd certainly be happy to see fig 8s banned - they're one step up from hip belays. However, there are plenty of newer belay devices that don't generate that much friction on the rope - most of which are probably on the "acceptable" list.

I agree with nmonteith that Cliffhanger's approach of getting people to demonstrate device-specific competence gets around the problem of grigris and other auto-locking devices not being idiot proof.

I think Nunawading have also banned some particular harnesses. It would be interesting to know what evidence their insurers have that these harnesses are less safe than those on the "acceptable" list.

Anyone from Nunawading who can post some more details?

wyt91t

4-May-2006
9:59:13 AM

the firgure 8 is not a belay device.
its a decender and has shit all hope of catching a decent fall


tnd

4-May-2006
10:11:03 AM

On 4/05/2006 wyt91t wrote:
>the firgure 8 is not a belay device.
>its a decender and has shit all hope of catching a decent fall

Agreed. Yet Euros use them all the time. I have twice got into "discussions" with potential belayers here in Oz who pulled out a Fig 8 to belay me. One, a German guy, shrugged and agree to use an ATC, the other, the Slovakian girlfriend of a mate of mine, chucked a hissy fit, accusing me of being racist, we use these all the time over there, I can catch a big fall with this etc etc. After I refused to budge she sulked off and my mate belayed me (with an ATC).

Dalai

4-May-2006
10:18:18 AM

On 4/05/2006 tnd wrote:
>Agreed. Yet Euros use them all the time. I have twice got into "discussions"
>with potential belayers here in Oz who pulled out a Fig 8 to belay me.
>One, a German guy, shrugged and agree to use an ATC, the other, the Slovakian
>girlfriend of a mate of mine, chucked a hissy fit, accusing me of being
>racist, we use these all the time over there, I can catch a big fall with
>this etc etc. After I refused to budge she sulked off and my mate belayed
>me (with an ATC).

LOL. Reminded me once climbing at Ith in Northern Germany and I was belaying with my Gri Gri. Guy walking past starts blasting me and provided a long lecture about the virtues of the Munter Hitch and the evils of any other belay method!

After our lengthy disagreement - we ended up being best of mates and climbed the rest of the week together... and I kept using my Gri Gri.

It is amazing the regional differences with methods and equipment!


Rupert

4-May-2006
10:34:19 AM

any thoughts on the practice of belaying through the small hole on a figure 8? Used in the same manner as an atc or stitch plate this works well. However I don't know what the strength rating is ...as this was not what the fig 8 was made for.


oweng

4-May-2006
10:55:22 AM

When I started climbing I only had a Figure 8, and belayed for a year or two through the small hole. Seemed to work fine, and I cant see any major problems with it.

Andaroo

4-May-2006
11:16:14 AM

I was at Willyabrup (Marg River WA) a few months ago and there was a group of about 30 young (12-15yo) scouts climbing TR on 20-30m climbs belaying using figure 8s.. It appeared to be an "accreditted" company guiding them... Pretty scary..


billk

4-May-2006
11:18:04 AM

On 4/05/2006 oweng wrote:
>When I started climbing I only had a Figure 8, and belayed for a year or
>two through the small hole. Seemed to work fine, and I cant see any major
>problems with it.

That seems to be the safest way but I think how well it works is dependent on the particular rope and fig 8 you are using. I've used it on request from a particular climber at a gym and found it very sticky. No problems catching him but a few feeding the rope out quickly enough.

Malcolm Matheson has some really fancy way of using a fig 8 as an autolocker but not too many people have his attention to detail so I wouldn't want to see lots of people trying to copy it.

Unfortunately there are still lots of people who still think the rapelling rig for a fig 8 is suitable for belaying a lead climber.

I actually don't think the rapelling rig is even any good for rapelling - it twists the rope and knots in the ends of your rope will probably pass through in the event you rap that far down the rope. Abseiling enthusiasts probably have a different take.


tnd

4-May-2006
11:31:58 AM

On 4/05/2006 Dalai wrote:
>...provided a long
>lecture about the virtues of the Munter Hitch and the evils of any other
>belay method!
>
At least the Munter Hitch will catch a fall. Of course it is not very good for the rope.

As others mention above, one can use the small aperture of a Figure 8 as a Sticht plate (Black Diamond document this for their version of the Fig 8). As Bill says, they aren't even that good for rapping, due to rope twisting and allowing a knot through. I reckon the Fig 8 belongs in a museum these days (or on Slovakian crags...).

There are 85 messages in this topic.