Goto Chockstone Home

  Guide
  Gallery
  Tech Tips
  Articles
  Reviews
  Dictionary
  Links
  Forum
  Search
  About

      Sponsored By
      ROCK
   HARDWARE

  Shop

Edelrid: "Ultralight Helmet" (Turquoise) Mid blue .Fits 54 - 60cm Great heavy duty all-rounder. SUPER SPECIAL for a short time only!  $79.00
21% Off

Chockstone Photography Australian Landscape Photography by Michael Boniwell
Australian Landscape Prints





Chockstone Forum - General Discussion

General Climbing Discussion

 Page 1 of 3. Messages 1 to 20 | 21 to 40 | 41 to 43
Author
Ewbank Grading - articles by Ewbank.

ajfclark
5/07/2012
9:48:25 AM
I've been discussing this with Egosan and he's found some interesting articles from Ewbank on his grading system that seem to contradict rather than complement his earlier writing in the Blue Mountains guide.

Here's the blurb from his Blue Mountains Guide, copied from the guides page on chockstone:
Australian Ewbank Grading System
Courtesy of Ewbank himself...

STANDARDS:
The English grading system has been abused in Australia since 1951. Without discussing the why’s and wherefores, I shall try to explain the revolutionary system here. There is no “mild” or “hard” subdivisions. (e.g. “mild” severe, “hard” very difficult). No inferior or superior subdivisions (Dolomites system). e.g. 5 ‘Inf’. 6 ‘Sup’, No letters (S. Africa) e.g. El, E2, A, G. The 'Tarquitze Rock Decimal System' (U.S.A) 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 5.1 to 5.10, 6.1 to 6.6.

My head is spinning already.This system is the simplest used so far, to my knowledge, in the world, It also has a chance of working. None of the others are doing so too well at present. This system starts, it has no finish. There are no sub-divisions. Each grade has its own separate number.

Grading takes the following into consideration. Technical difficulty, exposure, length, quality of rock, protection and other smaller factors. As these are more or less all related to each other, I have rejected the idea of 3 or 4 grades, i.e. one for exposure, one for technical difficulty, one for protection etc. Instead the climb is given its one general grading, and if any of the other factors is outstanding, this is stated verbally in the short introduction to that climb, e.g.

'Freds Frolic’ 17. 302’-6” A fine climb, marred by poor rock at (crux) and poor protection on 4th pitch. etc, etc.

I feel that this system will soon be accepted, and the Americans seem to be thinking of something along similar lines.

As far as protection goes, the general terms “good”, “fair”, “poor” are used. However, it should be noted that I have taken the use of modern gear into account, and therefore this point will vary according to the individual, the amount of "silent aids" he carries and his ability to use them.

MECHANICAL GRADING:
The system being used for grading mechanical climbs or pitches is similar to above, without so many different grades. The top grades of mechanical climbing in England is classed A.4. As pegging (‘Artificial’ ~ ‘Mechanical’) is as variable in difficulty as free climbing., I have added more numbers on, with the prefix of the letter ‘M’. A climb with a mechanical pitch and free climbing would be graded say, 15. M.3.

If a climb uses only one pitch (sic – should read piton. Ed.) for physical aid, the climb is graded free and the piton mentioned. If a climb uses two or any number of pitons for physical aid, but they are separated by free moves then the climb is still regarded as free with aid. For example: Pitch 3. 60’. (crux). Straight up the groove, ‘4 pitons for aid’. However if two aids are used in succession with no free climbing in between., then that particular section is regarded as mechanical. A climb, may therefore be free, aided, and mechanica1, though only the two grades are used - i.e. 18 and M.5. while the aided portion of the climb is described verbally in the description.

The easiest mechanical grade (M.1.) therefore applies to such things as two firm bolts, close together, in any easy position on good rock.



From Thrutch, April 1968:












And from Climb #6 (anyone have a date for this?):







Anyway, I thought others might find them interesting to read.
simey
5/07/2012
10:14:40 AM
Where does he contradict his earlier writing?

ajfclark
5/07/2012
10:28:18 AM
Maybe contradict is the wrong word or I'm being too literal with what's written?

The BMG article says "Grading takes the following into consideration: Technical difficulty, exposure, length, quality of rock, protection and other smaller factors." and in the Climb article he says the number only covers the technical difficulty (2nd column, 2nd page).

The discussion Sol and I were having revolved around whether the quality, intricacy and difficultly or arranging of the pro should affect the grade of a route.
Winston Smith
5/07/2012
10:30:08 AM
Complement....

ajfclark
5/07/2012
10:32:00 AM
Thanks Winston, typo corrected.
One Day Hero
5/07/2012
11:03:12 AM
Seriously, who gives a shit? If you just accept an error of +/- 1 grade, then it probably covers all of that shit anyway. Besides, I would expect any credible route developers to to apply deliberate inconsistency greater than that just to fuch with people.
simey
5/07/2012
11:54:47 AM
You are right in your interpretation of the two articles. Ewbank's grading system has evolved (or mutated) slightly so as to allow some discretion for boldness within the grade. Given that Ewbank wanted a practical grading system and given that technical difficulty is subjective anyway, then the current approach of occasionally adding a grade for boldness is the practical application of his grading system. It embodies Harlin's quote that Ewbank acknowledges in his first article, 'Everything in climbing is relevant to other factors'.
gfdonc
5/07/2012
11:58:12 AM
I really like the disclosure that I can use one point of aid and still claim the free ascent. Still won't get me up Punks though.
mikllaw
5/07/2012
12:02:43 PM
I think everyone would like the grade to indicate how hard the climb is.
If it is only a technical move, that's the main factor.
If it's sustained and scary, they are the main factors.
Simple

Whatever he's saying now, that's how grading is used in Australia (since 74 at least).

Some Americans like to grade the hardest move, which is amusing ("I can climb any 5.12, but I can't get up any 5.12" -?)
simey
5/07/2012
12:04:59 PM
On 5/07/2012 gfdonc wrote:
>I really like the disclosure that I can use one point of aid and still
>claim the free ascent. Still won't get me up Punks though.

I didn't interpret that anywhere in the articles.
gfdonc
5/07/2012
3:53:05 PM
On 5/07/2012 simey wrote:

>I didn't interpret that anywhere in the articles.


"If a climb uses only one pitch (sic – should read piton. Ed.) for physical aid, the climb is graded free"

Eduardo Slabofvic
5/07/2012
4:39:56 PM
Where does it say that a guide book writer can just grade routes what ever they like?
kieranl
5/07/2012
5:01:26 PM
On 5/07/2012 Eduardo Slabofvic. wrote:
>Where does it say that a guide book writer can just grade routes what ever
>they like?
Anything that is not expressly permitted is forbidden, and even that which is permitted is doubtful.
simey
5/07/2012
8:57:19 PM
On 5/07/2012 Eduardo Slabofvic. wrote:
>Where does it say that a guide book writer can just grade routes what ever they like?

Well you are either born the Son(s) of God or you aren't. Louise's guide to Arapiles was like the Old Testament. It still has some relevance, but the New Testament was required to clarify God's word.
One Day Hero
5/07/2012
9:45:23 PM
On 5/07/2012 simey wrote:
>Well you are either born the Son(s) of God or you aren't. Louise's guide
>to Arapiles was like the Old Testament. It still has some relevance, but
>the New Testament was required to clarify God's word.
>
I've only ever owned the old arapiles testament. I'm quite attached to the thing but it isn't literal, you gotta work to understand what it's trying to teach you............also, there's a few too many begats.

Eduardo Slabofvic
5/07/2012
9:51:59 PM
Guide book writers just up grade the routes they find hard, so they seem less pathetic than they really are, as otherwise, why would they be writing guide books. Its obvious really.
dalai
5/07/2012
9:52:32 PM
On 5/07/2012 One Day Hero wrote:
>On 5/07/2012 simey wrote:
>>Well you are either born the Son(s) of God or you aren't. Louise's guide
>>to Arapiles was like the Old Testament. It still has some relevance,
>but
>>the New Testament was required to clarify God's word.
>>
>I've only ever owned the old arapiles testament. I'm quite attached to
>the thing but it isn't literal, you gotta work to understand what it's
>trying to teach you............also, there's a few too many begats.

If Louise's guide is the old testament - what is my Carrigan's guide then?
widewetandslippery
5/07/2012
9:56:26 PM
I thought the shepard book was to araps guide books what mormanism is to christianity.
climberman
5/07/2012
10:16:18 PM
On 5/07/2012 dalai wrote:
>On 5/07/2012 One Day Hero wrote:
>>On 5/07/2012 simey wrote:
>>>Well you are either born the Son(s) of God or you aren't. Louise's guide
>>>to Arapiles was like the Old Testament. It still has some relevance,
>>but
>>>the New Testament was required to clarify God's word.
>>>
>>I've only ever owned the old arapiles testament. I'm quite attached to
>>the thing but it isn't literal, you gotta work to understand what it's
>>trying to teach you............also, there's a few too many begats.
>
>If Louise's guide is the old testament - what is my Carrigan's guide then?

Dead Sea scrolls
One Day Hero
5/07/2012
10:17:12 PM
On 5/07/2012 dalai wrote:
>
>If Louise's guide is the old testament - what is my Carrigan's guide then?

Actually, I lied. Years ago I found a copy of that Carrigan guide in the National Library and photocopied it cover to cover.

 Page 1 of 3. Messages 1 to 20 | 21 to 40 | 41 to 43
There are 43 messages in this topic.

 

Home | Guide | Gallery | Tech Tips | Articles | Reviews | Dictionary | Forum | Links | About | Search
Chockstone Photography | Landscape Photography Australia | Australian Landscape Photography

Please read the full disclaimer before using any information contained on these pages.



Australian Panoramic | Australian Coast | Australian Mountains | Australian Countryside | Australian Waterfalls | Australian Lakes | Australian Cities | Australian Macro | Australian Wildlife
Landscape Photo | Landscape Photography | Landscape Photography Australia | Fine Art Photography | Wilderness Photography | Nature Photo | Australian Landscape Photo | Stock Photography Australia | Landscape Photos | Panoramic Photos | Panoramic Photography Australia | Australian Landscape Photography | Mothers Day Gifts | Gifts for Mothers Day | Mothers Day Gift Ideas | Ideas for Mothers Day | Wedding Gift Ideas | Christmas Gift Ideas | Fathers Day Gifts | Gifts for Fathers Day | Fathers Day Gift Ideas | Ideas for Fathers Day | Landscape Prints | Landscape Poster | Limited Edition Prints | Panoramic Photo | Buy Posters | Poster Prints