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Chockstone Forum - Accidents & Injuries

Report Accidents and Injuries

 Page 5 of 9. Messages 1 to 20 | 21 to 40 | 41 to 60 | 61 to 80 | 81 to 100 | 101 to 120 | 121 to 140 | 141 to 160 | 161 to 174
Author
biner breaks on Forever Young

deadbudgy
13/12/2011
1:04:48 PM
I don't think this situation is as uncommon as people are making out. I have had biners orientate themselves like this before a couple of times in U bolts. I have always noticed it though and tourned it back over before continuing with the climbing. As you climb past the bolt you accidently flip over the quick draw. Most of the time it falls back down again
mikllaw
14/12/2011
2:19:21 PM
On 13/12/2011 deadbudgy wrote:
>I don't think this situation is as uncommon as people are making out. I
>have had biners orientate themselves like this before a couple of times
>in U bolts. I have always noticed it though and tourned it back over before
>continuing with the climbing. As you climb past the bolt you accidently
>flip over the quick draw. Most of the time it falls back down again

I think I've heard reports of this happening in right angle bolt brackets also- the type which fits on a Dynabolt, Rawl, or Trubolt. The biner jambs against the nut.
mikllaw
14/12/2011
2:23:27 PM
>>
I made a quick model with the equivalent of bodyweight on the black sling. For the likely 6061T6 Aluminium alloy used its tensile strength is about 350 MPa. The grey area in the picture below indicates material above this level (i.e. failed). Failure would have initiated at the lower pin due to the contact stresses.


DJ Biggs
14/12/2011
2:51:54 PM
Nice model, is it possible to tweak it so its not all round stock?
One Day Hero
14/12/2011
4:31:21 PM
On 14/12/2011 DJ Biggs wrote:
>...........is it possible to tweak it so its not all round stock?

Why would you want to do that? To prove that a non-round biner can break like that? You don't need a computer model to tell you that can happen, because it just happened!!!

Computer models don't make things happen. Things happen, then computer models seek to explain them. If you see a thing happen, then don't believe that it has happened until a computer model tells you that it can happen, you must be some kind of extra special retard!

Hendo
14/12/2011
5:02:34 PM
On 13/12/2011 Climboholic wrote:

>He said there was no take in the rope when it broke. This SHOULD NOT HAPPEN
>no matter which way the biner is loaded!

If the biner just snapped without deforming much then there wouldn't be as much energy involved (E =F*d). If so he wouldn't have felt the rope take as you might otherwise expect.

Climboholic
14/12/2011
5:34:53 PM
Thanks for the model Mikl. It shows that failure is possible in bending at just bodyweight! I'm going to think twice before buying those uber-lightweight biners I was looking at.

On 14/12/2011 Hendo wrote:
>On 13/12/2011 Climboholic wrote:
>
>>He said there was no take in the rope when it broke. This SHOULD NOT
>HAPPEN
>>no matter which way the biner is loaded!
>
>If the biner just snapped without deforming much then there wouldn't be
>as much energy involved (E =F*d). If so he wouldn't have felt the rope
>take as you might otherwise expect.

I totally agree. I did mention in an earlier post that there are a number of factors which would prevent the climber feeling the take in the rope. But he said “absolutely no take in the rope when I heard a snap”, which is physically impossible. Thus proving the lack of reliability of witnesses.
widewetandslippery
14/12/2011
6:14:14 PM
I belayed the first ascent of smooth boy at smith rocks usa (I am a famous belayer) and on an early attempt one of those 80s cooil (in an 80s way) snaped due to bad bolt placement. Short fall and no hurting but hell it put the wind. Up us all.

Miguel75
14/12/2011
6:32:41 PM
On 14/12/2011 One Day Hero wrote:
>If you see a thing happen, then don't believe that it has happened until a computer model tells you >that it can happen, you must be some kind of extra special retard!

I almost choked on my poached egg and can still feel a bit of toast somewhere in the back of my nose... This is an all time quotable quote.
citationx
14/12/2011
7:16:08 PM
On 12/12/2011 nmonteith wrote:
>On 12/12/2011 shortman wrote:
>>Were u using double ropes?
>
>I should have explained better. I didn't cut the rope fully, just sliced
>through the whole sheeth on a fall. I've had it happen twice, both times
>with no sharp rock edges - i think the sharp gates of biners can cut ropes.
>That's my theory anyway.
>
>
>This is from one incident - at Werribie Gorge of all places.

I agree about the stripping/sharp gates on biners. Funnily enough it was when none other than ben wiessner was belaying me at st peters years ago (you're turning it into a habit, ben). when i fell leading the rope came taught against one of the ends of the gate and the sharpness cut the sheath. looked similar to yours. It was an omega pacific biner. I posted about it on here somewhere. the distributor said OP may contact me for details, but instead they just did their own dependent-independent testing and said that it must've been something ben or I did wrong because their own dependent-independent test proved that their biners were still the best in the market. :-)
One Day Hero
15/12/2011
12:12:39 AM
On 15/12/2011 One Day Hero wrote:
>On 14/12/2011 Climboholic wrote:
>
>I totally agree. I did mention in an earlier post that there are a number
>of factors which would prevent the climber feeling the take in the rope.
>But he said “absolutely no take in the rope when I heard a snap”, which
>is physically impossible. Thus proving the lack of reliability of witnesses.

See, this is why I think [Dalai Edit].

If you're used to falling on a rope and being pulled up at 2-3g, then
0.5g for a tenth of a second is going to feel very much like no load. Anyone
who fancies themselves as being a bit intelligent should be able to work
that out.

Rob and Ben both wrote very clear and accurate accounts of the incident,
and worked out what caused the thing to snap. Shit only got confusing when
you decided to introduce pointless complications and wild assumptions.
Luckily, Mike produced a computer simulation, and now you know that what
happened can actually happen so everything is ok.

[Dalai Edit]


Dalai Edit - once again you have directly attacked another member of the board. One week time out...

You have been warned often enough OHD.
GusR
15/12/2011
10:36:07 AM
wow - Abaqus! impressive. Don't you pay per run with that program?

Climboholic
15/12/2011
1:46:28 PM
ADHD continues his assault on engineers. From the 'Slackline - fatigue effects on biners?' thread:

On 16/06/2010 One Day Hero wrote:
>On 15/06/2010 alg wrote:
>>one for the engineers/metallurgists...
>
>Rather than theorists, ask the guys in the lab........there are thousands
>of people out there logging thousands of hours boinging on exactly the
>same setup you will use. I don't know why they do it, seems rather boring
>to me.....but, the experiment has been done and will yield much more useful
>info than wanky speculation.
>
>So, anybody broken a biner slacklining? Seen one break? Have reliable
>reports of them breaking?
>
>My guess is that it doesn't happen cause you'd have heard about it already...........hey,
>why can't you afford 4 old biners for slackline duties? Are you a single
>mum?

What do you have against engineers? Could it be that you're just too lazy to think about why things happen, so you lash out at people who do as a self defence mechanism?


shortman
15/12/2011
2:11:15 PM
On 15/12/2011 Climboholic wrote:
>ADHD continues his assault on engineers. From the 'Slackline - fatigue
>effects on biners?' thread:
>
>On 16/06/2010 One Day Hero wrote:
>>On 15/06/2010 alg wrote:
>>>one for the engineers/metallurgists...
>>
>>Rather than theorists, ask the guys in the lab........there are thousands
>>of people out there logging thousands of hours boinging on exactly the
>>same setup you will use. I don't know why they do it, seems rather boring
>>to me.....but, the experiment has been done and will yield much more
>useful
>>info than wanky speculation.
>>
>>So, anybody broken a biner slacklining? Seen one break? Have reliable
>>reports of them breaking?
>>
>>My guess is that it doesn't happen cause you'd have heard about it already...........hey
>
>>why can't you afford 4 old biners for slackline duties? Are you a single
>>mum?
>
>What do you have against engineers? Could it be that you're just too lazy
>to think about why things happen, so you lash out at people who do as a
>self defence mechanism?

I'vd seen 'em bend. I've seen em break and become very fast moving objects. Scary as. Everytime it was because they were not locked either at all or fully.
>
>
Will_P
15/12/2011
2:31:48 PM
On 16/06/2010 One Day Hero wrote:
"...why can't you afford 4 old biners for slackline duties? Are you a single mum?"
On 15/12/2011 Climboholic wrote:
"What do you have against engineers? Could it be that you're just too lazy to think about why things happen, so you lash out at people who do as a self defence mechanism?"

And single mums. What are you picken' on them for too, ODH? Or are you targeting single mums who slackline? (No, I don't mean like that) Or single mum engineers who slackline? That's a minority group right there buddy, so watch out.
dalai
15/12/2011
3:27:33 PM
Guys - please focus on the topic about the breaking krab and not OHD. His account has been disabled for a week so won't be able to respond...
Will_P
15/12/2011
5:22:51 PM
I was trying to, but Jammin never responded to my queries, and ODH is amusing, and the reaction to him cracks me up (until I'm his target)... why'd you have to go and gag him? At least prompt Jammin for some more input on 'biner breakage in the meantime.
dalai
15/12/2011
5:36:56 PM
On 15/12/2011 Will_P wrote:
>why'd you have to go and gag him?

Because he was playing the man and not the ball.

From http://www.chockstone.org/Forum/Forum.asp?Action=Help&Topic=SPAM

Posts containing extremely offensive language, blatant racism, sexual harassment, or out right personal attacks on other forum members are unacceptable.

wombly
15/12/2011
8:11:23 PM
>Because he was playing the man and not the ball.

ODH's post and while relatively moderate compared to the horse thread dragged up recently, but was personally directed as dalai suggests. However, it did contain some relevant defence of the observations by the original posters in response to:

>But he said “absolutely no take in the rope when I heard a snap”, which
>is physically impossible. Thus proving the lack of reliability of witnesses

that is relevant to the thread and discussion.

[Post edit - and has how been returned]
dalai
15/12/2011
8:44:35 PM
Moderate perhaps compared to other posts where the other mods had asked him to go back and edit plus has been repeatedly asked to stop the direct personal attacks and he hasn't. Therefore I disabled his account and will re-enable next week.

The reason OHD hasn't been banned permanently is he does make relevant and often good posts which contribute to the discussions. Just unfortunately sometimes he is lacking tact in the way he presents his argument. The forum rules are clear in this regard...

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There are 174 messages in this topic.

 

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