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Chockstone Forum - Accidents & Injuries

Report Accidents and Injuries

 Page 4 of 9. Messages 1 to 20 | 21 to 40 | 41 to 60 | 61 to 80 | 81 to 100 | 101 to 120 | 121 to 140 | 141 to 160 | 161 to 174
Author
biner breaks on Forever Young
pecheur
12/12/2011
10:11:25 AM
On 12/12/2011 Climboholic wrote:

>The point made by pecheur that it wasnít bending failure because of where
>it broke isnít necessarily correct. Iíve tested biners to failure with
>design load (bending) and theyíve broken in the same place. Fatigue is
>possible if the biner had an indentation from a heavy fall on a fixed hangar
>which could act as a crack nucleation point.
>
>I suggest either sending the failed biner back to the manufacturer or
>sending it to someone like Mikl (who I believe is a Materials Engineer),
>to figure out exactly what happened.
>
I should comment that I deemed it unlikely to be bending from the pics, which I stand by. You could make a biner break there via bending, but given the situation I'd put it in the unlikely category.
NMcKinnon
12/12/2011
12:07:11 PM
How many engineer's does it take to diagnose a biner failure?

Thanks to the guys who posted this story and for the updated descriptions about what occurred. Another thing to keep a watch out for in the future, both when I'm climbing and belaying.

IdratherbeclimbingM9
12/12/2011
12:33:08 PM
On 12/12/2011 NMcKinnon wrote:
>How many engineer's does it take to diagnose a biner failure?
>
How many posters does it take to create an argument debate on Chockstone?
Heh, heh, heh.



>Thanks to the guys who posted this story and for the updated descriptions
>about what occurred. Another thing to keep a watch out for in the future,
>both when I'm climbing and belaying.

+1

Climboholic
12/12/2011
12:51:33 PM
What I'm saying is that it probably isn't as simple as people are making out. There was possibly a pre-existing crack in the biner.

nmonteith
12/12/2011
1:45:01 PM
On 12/12/2011 Climboholic wrote:
>What I'm saying is that it probably isn't as simple as people are making
>out. There was possibly a pre-existing crack in the biner.

I doubt it. I think it just jammed in a tight spot facing upwards, and the fall just created a very nasty leverage which snapped it. I've broken a biner at Bowens Creek in a similar situation - I still don't know what actually made the one I broke break. I fell off, it went snap and i fell down to the next quickdraw.

IdratherbeclimbingM9
12/12/2011
2:22:03 PM
On 12/12/2011 nmonteith wrote:
>I think it just jammed in a tight spot facing upwards, and
>the fall just created a very nasty leverage which snapped it. I've broken
>a biner at Bowens Creek in a similar situation - I still don't know what
>actually made the one I broke break. I fell off, it went snap and i fell
>down to the next quickdraw.

Oooerrh.
I am glad I am not a sport climber as that kind of freaky nasty happening would give me nightmares...
;-)

nmonteith
12/12/2011
2:34:52 PM
I've had trad gear break or strip and ropes cut. The only thing anyone needs to know is try and have redundancy in your system. Without it, a small incident could be deadly.

shortman
12/12/2011
3:17:04 PM
On 12/12/2011 nmonteith wrote:
>I've had trad gear break or strip and ropes cut. The only thing anyone
>needs to know is try and have redundancy in your system. Without it, a
>small incident could be deadly.

Were u using double ropes?

Tell tell!

nmonteith
12/12/2011
3:27:53 PM
On 12/12/2011 shortman wrote:
>Were u using double ropes?

I should have explained better. I didn't cut the rope fully, just sliced through the whole sheeth on a fall. I've had it happen twice, both times with no sharp rock edges - i think the sharp gates of biners can cut ropes. That's my theory anyway.


This is from one incident - at Werribie Gorge of all places.

shortman
12/12/2011
3:35:07 PM
Trippy

rodw
12/12/2011
3:46:28 PM

>I should have explained better. I didn't cut the rope fully, just sliced
>through the whole sheeth on a fall. I've had it happen twice, both times
>with no sharp rock edges ->Were u using double ropes?
> i think the sharp gates of biners can cut ropes.
>That's my theory anyway.

Good theory...Ive had it happen to one of my ropes first time out of the bag....fall onto biner barely half mater above it...only thing it could have been was catch on gate of biner.
kieranl
12/12/2011
3:46:47 PM
Dan, keep away from Werribee, it's a death trap.

shortman
12/12/2011
4:14:31 PM
On 12/12/2011 kieranl wrote:
>Dan, keep away from Werribee, it's a death trap.

Na, werribee is alright. It's close and kinda grows on u after a while. A bit of glue would fix the joint up.
ben wiessner
12/12/2011
5:31:41 PM
I hope this photo helps clarify.



So kids! Beware if you see a biner behaving like this.

On another note, I discovered yesterday that the problem cannot be rectified on Forever Young with a cold chisel and a hammer. A drill is required!

nmonteith
12/12/2011
5:35:06 PM
Interestingly that rock surface looks quite ripply - not much surface that is flat. And from the sideways photos it clearly shows a bulge of rock in between the two legs.

Thanks Ben for attempting to fix this so quickly! I would have thought a masonry chisel would have worked? A masonry drill bit and a hammer would probably work - pretty much like a rudimentary hand-drill.

Miguel75
12/12/2011
8:11:36 PM
On 12/12/2011 kieranl wrote:
>Dan, keep away from Werribee, it's a death trap.

Blasphemy!

WG has plenty of love! It's just the loose rock on top, punters (such as myself) and greasy holds you need to watch out for...:)
One Day Hero
12/12/2011
8:31:11 PM
On 12/12/2011 Climboholic wrote:
>What I'm saying is that it probably isn't as simple as people are making
>out. There was possibly a pre-existing crack in the biner.

I reckon its exactly as simple as people are making out. I also reckon you're either a pretty good troll, or the sort of engineer I have nightmares about (great in a classroom but doesn't have the practical knowledge to even fix their own pushie). I hope I never end up driving over one of your bridges!

Climboholic
13/12/2011
11:51:28 AM
On 12/12/2011 One Day Hero wrote:
>On 12/12/2011 Climboholic wrote:
>>What I'm saying is that it probably isn't as simple as people are making
>>out. There was possibly a pre-existing crack in the biner.
>
>I reckon its exactly as simple as people are making out. I also reckon
>you're either a pretty good troll, or the sort of engineer I have nightmares
>about (great in a classroom but doesn't have the practical knowledge to
>even fix their own pushie). I hope I never end up driving over one of your
>bridges!

He said there was no take in the rope when it broke. This SHOULD NOT HAPPEN no matter which way the biner is loaded!

I agree that it probably failed in torsion as people are suggesting but I wouldn't bet my life on it. I'd get someone to look at the fracture surface if they were my biners, to make sure nothing else is going on.

Btw, I fix my own car, motorbike and pushie... and I work on aircraft not bridges.

Climboholic
13/12/2011
11:57:37 AM
On 12/12/2011 ben wiessner wrote:
>I hope this photo helps clarify.
>
>
>
>So kids! Beware if you see a biner behaving like this.
>
>On another note, I discovered yesterday that the problem cannot be rectified
>on Forever Young with a cold chisel and a hammer. A drill is required!

Ben,

How did you manage to get the quickdraw in that orientation after placing it normally? I'm guessing it happened as you climbed past?

IdratherbeclimbingM9
13/12/2011
12:30:44 PM
On 13/12/2011 Climboholic wrote:
>Ben,
>
>How did you manage to get the quickdraw in that orientation after placing
>it normally? I'm guessing it happened as you climbed past?

Ben already answered you! and this was supported (of sorts), by the robby post ...
:)

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There are 174 messages in this topic.

 

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