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Chockstone Forum - General Discussion

General Climbing Discussion

 Page 12 of 16. Messages 1 to 20 | 21 to 40 | 41 to 60 | 61 to 80 | 81 to 100 | 101 to 120 | 121 to 140 | 141 to 160 | 161 to 180 | 181 to 200 | 201 to 220 | 221 to 240 | 241 to 260 | 261 to 280 | 281 to 300 | 301 to 307
Author
Trashing Tassie ... it's beyond salvation

IdratherbeclimbingM9
20/03/2011
9:36:08 PM
On 20/03/2011 davidn wrote:
>On 20/03/2011 jesus wrote:
>
>>....yes ...its all become rather messy ... ppl not understand that the
>>simple Ubank system only takes into account , the technically hardest
>move
>>on a route ... so while one person might have an epic on a grade 20 crack
>>... stressin & fadin ... hanging around selecting n placing 10 runners
>>... Henry Barber might do the same route ' effortlessly cos HE only needs
>>2 or 3 runners to make a confident ascent ...BUT ... the grade remains
>>the same ...

>
>This, I can actually agree with.

Then you are both wrong (re the bit in bold type), and you (hex) ought to know better than to spread misinformation, having been around for as long as you have!
~> and to emphasise the point, if the route is free soloed, ie with no gear, the grade still remains the same!!

jesus
21/03/2011
6:15:11 AM
>>>the vast majority of bolted climbs in Tasmania are well concieved and well bolted....

: D

>>>I dont really care anymore. Good day sir....

: D

Seeya mate ....

: D
jesus
21/03/2011
6:17:09 AM



THIS IS TOTALLY AGREEABLE...


I actually think Jesus has a good point amongst all this randomness........
Double standards about bolting in Tassie wilderness seems like a real issue.........The
slow eroding of old school trad crags into sport venues is happening all
over Australua........


.... THOUROUGHLY AGREEABLE





jesus
21/03/2011
6:19:28 AM
>>>talking to parks about bolts in the park.

: D

ur too late , buddy !

: D
jesus
21/03/2011
6:20:39 AM


TraSHiNg Tassie ...............it's beyond salvation ......




THIS IS TOTALLY AGREEABLE...


I actually think Jesus has a good point amongst all this randomness........
Double standards about bolting in Tassie wilderness seems like a real issue.........The
slow eroding of old school trad crags into sport venues is happening all
over Australua........


.... THOUROUGHLY AGREEABLE





jesus
21/03/2011
6:33:05 AM



...this space is reserved for climbing community contemplation of Neil's brilliance ...





jesus
21/03/2011
6:36:16 AM
....thank you to anyone who red da thred....

...mission accomplished....











#############################################################


aoraki
21/03/2011
10:32:08 AM
>>> I actually think Jesus has a good point amongst all this randomness........
Double standards about bolting in Tassie wilderness seems like a real issue.........Theslow eroding of old school trad crags into sport venues is happening all over Australua........


Ben Lomond, Mt Wellington & Fingal aint wilderness. They all have had a huge amount of human impact on them.

Tasmania has a well defined wilderness area:
The Tasmanian Wilderness World Heritage Area
http://www.parks.tas.gov.au/index.aspx?base=391

It includes, amongst many other unexplored crags:

Frenchmans Cap
Federation Peak / Eastern Arthurs
Western Arthurs
Frankland Range
Mt Anne
Mt Geryon & The Acropolis
Mt Oakleigh
Cradle Mountain
Barn Bluff
Walls of Jerusalem
The Guardians
Precipitous Bluff
Sentinel Range

*These* are the crags we should be fighting to keep bolt free.
jesus
21/03/2011
10:49:02 AM
Generally two separate BUT related isses :

>>>I actually think Jesus has a good point amongst all this randomness........
>>>Double standards about bolting in Tassie wilderness seems like a real issue........

eg Geryon / Acropolis

>>>Theslow eroding of old school trad crags into sport venues is happening all over >>>Australua........

eg Fingal

Now before I depart to get ready for Easter ... more effort ppl please to understand the difference between SPORT....TRAD .... ADVENTURE ...... and not confusing WILDERNESS with WILDNESS ......



CYA


: )




#########################################







Climboholic
21/03/2011
3:50:14 PM
On 21/03/2011 davidn wrote:
>So what was your point? That free soloing should change the grade? Your
>post confused me.

Jeee...zus...Christ!

It's not that hard to unDERstand.
Wendy
21/03/2011
5:49:06 PM
I like this idea that climbs should get a harder grade if you put more gear in. Who came up with that one? I'll have to thank them, as obviously, everything I climb is at least 3 grades harder than it is for everyone else as I place gear every 30cm or so.
PDRM
21/03/2011
9:01:48 PM
On 21/03/2011 davidn wrote:
>Yes, well... See the other thread where I proposed that a (normally grade
>30+) 10 metre climb with 50 bolts in it should actually be grade 5.
>
>Though I think having lots of good pro makes the climb easier under their
>system? So if you have to do a double dyno from a crimp rail to a crimp
>rail in ground fall territory, it's still only a grade 15 if you could
>have placed 8 pieces of gear on the 8 metre climb... At least, that's
>my understanding of the 'system' (read: bastardisation of Ewbank's proposed
>system)

Go climb some US aid routes...

P

Doug
22/03/2011
9:31:42 AM
Re the whole notion of this whole thread "Trashing Tassie ... it's beyond salvation" ... please Sir Jesus, don't say so ...

I wonder ... is this a case of Environmental Envy? After all, we have so much down here in Tassie in the way of variety and unexplored potential, so all the back-biting over what is a relatively small percentage of the landscape is a bit like pissing in the ocean. Sure, there is some disagreement over the way the "home crags" have been developed but is this not the case everywhere?
As for the notion of "salvation", if Tassie has lost its lustre in the eyes of some, maybe the finer notion of "redemption" (http://mb-soft.com/believe/txw/redempti.htm) is more to the point. Of course, no-one has any idea of how to redeem our state of climbing grace from the self-appointed God of Ben Lomond.
Tastrad
22/03/2011
4:54:37 PM
Redemption means to rescue, deliver, save from sin or purchase something back. We are saving Ben Lomond from the likes of Doug Bruce and the insidious attitude towards climbing that he preaches. I once told Doug of a new route I did on Mt Blackwood, done onsight and ground up on a 90m face, with a 12m runout on solid grade 22 climbing. Doug asked how I would react if someone put bolts in the runout section. Chop them of course, but Doug replied that I don't have the right to dictate to future ascensionists that it must be climbed in that bold style. He argued that by definition, a route is something well travelled - so in that sense the climb on Mt Blackwood is not a route, and will forever remain simply a testimony of my boldness and ego. The climb is useless because not everyone is up to leading 12m runouts on grade 22. Its this mentality which lead a local climber to bolt a gym hold to the cliff to create a route for everyone to enjoy (now free at 27), or to line an offwidth with bolts because not everyone owns a 5 camalot. Next he'll be calling Reinhold Messner an idiot because he climbed Everest solo without oxygen - he just wanted to do it in the best style possible. When consensus is not possible, sometimes you just have to act, so Doug Fife and I acted to remove the abseil bolts on the Ben and remove all ambiguity. If the bolts are reinstalled, with Doug's attitude the rot will set in and soon there will be rap stations all over the cliff, lower-offs after first pitches, and eventually bolted climbs. All we want is one last bastion of trad purity left in Tasmania - climb on natural gear and descend by the traditional way as well.
pharmamatt
22/03/2011
5:10:54 PM
The Slippery slope argument!


On 22/03/2011 Tastrad wrote:
>Redemption means to rescue, deliver, save from sin or purchase something
>back. We are saving Ben Lomond from the likes of Doug Bruce and the insidious
>attitude towards climbing that he preaches. I once told Doug of a new route
>I did on Mt Blackwood, done onsight and ground up on a 90m face, with a
>12m runout on solid grade 22 climbing. Doug asked how I would react if
>someone put bolts in the runout section. Chop them of course, but Doug
>replied that I don't have the right to dictate to future ascensionists
>that it must be climbed in that bold style. He argued that by definition,
>a route is something well travelled - so in that sense the climb on Mt
>Blackwood is not a route, and will forever remain simply a testimony of
>my boldness and ego. The climb is useless because not everyone is up to
>leading 12m runouts on grade 22. Its this mentality which lead a local
>climber to bolt a gym hold to the cliff to create a route for everyone
>to enjoy (now free at 27), or to line an offwidth with bolts because not
>everyone owns a 5 camalot. Next he'll be calling Reinhold Messner an idiot
>because he climbed Everest solo without oxygen - he just wanted to do it
>in the best style possible. When consensus is not possible, sometimes you
>just have to act, so Doug Fife and I acted to remove the abseil bolts on
>the Ben and remove all ambiguity. If the bolts are reinstalled, with Doug's
>attitude the rot will set in and soon there will be rap stations all over
>the cliff, lower-offs after first pitches, and eventually bolted climbs.
>All we want is one last bastion of trad purity left in Tasmania - climb
>on natural gear and descend by the traditional way as well.

pharmamatt
22/03/2011
5:48:36 PM
I thought sharma said bouldering is dead!
pharmamatt
22/03/2011
6:33:01 PM
On 22/03/2011 davidn wrote:
>Sharma who? What's ee done on grit?

not much!




here's a link
http://climbingnarc.com/2009/09/why-chris-sharma-doesnt-boulder-more/#

Doug
22/03/2011
9:48:59 PM
On 22/03/2011 Tastrad wrote:
>Redemption means to rescue, deliver, save from sin or purchase something
>back. We are saving Ben Lomond from the likes of Doug Bruce and the insidious
>attitude towards climbing that he preaches.

Hook, line and sinker!!! Chuckle ...

The good Dr
23/03/2011
7:40:50 AM
On 22/03/2011 Doug Bruce wrote:
>On 22/03/2011 Tastrad wrote:
>>Redemption means to rescue, deliver, save from sin or purchase something
>>back. We are saving Ben Lomond from the likes of Doug Bruce and the insidious
>>attitude towards climbing that he preaches.
>
>Hook, line and sinker!!! Chuckle ...

Doug, you are an evil man. Imagine winding Gerry up like that. You knew no good would come of it. Your promoting bolting the crap out of everything, that is. Tastard is so against that kind of thing, being the ultimate hardman who never whimpers, or curses when he continually falls off things, or slaps piles of bolts in scrappy, worthless piles of nothing like all of the sport climbing weanies out there that he pitties. No, none of that ego for him. I can imagine Tastard hanging on that line and as that evil rap anchor came popping out he would have quietly and contemplatively though "in your sweet smiling face Doug Bruce, you and your phallic cranium, may the Lord have mercy on your black, withered soul. May this be a lesson to all that the forces of goodness, love, tolerance and respect will always shine through".

Climboholic
23/03/2011
8:41:31 AM
On 21/03/2011 davidn wrote:
>Didn't I mention bite me in a previous post? Oh, well then, bite me.
>
>Free soloing doesn't change the grade. The technically hardest move remains
>the same. Whether you shit yourself and fall off isn't the point. Every
>subjective aspect you introduce into a grade makes it more difficult to
>understand what the fuch the grade even means. Cause then Enzo Oddo comes
>along and downgrades your shit because he's a crazy fearless 15 year old.
> Or the guy climbing Noblesse Oblige over and over calls it a different
>grade because 'runout' means something completely different to him.

You still don't get it.

M9 was not saying that the grade gets harder for a free solo (correct me if I'm wrong). The Ewbank system is actually pretty simple. Even davidn SHOULD be able to get it!

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There are 307 messages in this topic.

 

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