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Accident on Loboff 5/3/2011 9-Mar-2011 At 3:56:09 PM Gavo

Message

On 9/03/2011 Wendy wrote:
>On 9/03/2011 gordoste wrote:
>>I find it a bit hard to swallow that the same people who go on and on
>about
>>lack of experience are the first to put the boot in when someone makes
>>a legitimate mistake. If you have never made mistakes and errors of judgement
>>yourself then you are not experienced. Also, your statements can easily
>>be used to support regulation of climbing (or more likely, compulsory
>rescue
>>insurance for outdoor enthusiasts).
>>The process of gaining experience is not a painless one. Constructive
>>ideas on prevention of accidents is great. Suggesting that people have
>>to be certain of success before trying something is really counter-productive.
>>
>
>There's a difference between being certain of success and making sensible
>route choices when pushing your limits. It doesn't take years of experience
>to see that loboff will be pumpy to protect, pulling up to see the crack
>will be strenuous, falling off will result in a pendulum and as a consequence,
>that there are many safer 16s around. This is called using your brain and
>thinking about what you are doing. Just in case people struggle to remember
>to use their brain, i go through this process of decision making with people
>when they are learning to lead, so they understand why some routes are
>better choices than others, but i would have thought it was reasonably
>obvious. If it's not reasonably obvious, then it's just yet another reason
>why it's worth paying for an instructor to learn to lead.

I have to say I disagree with that sentiment.

The idea that there are climbers out there who have never made a decision where IF they fell, they would have been quite badly hurt... I dont believe it.

I think loads of people have been in situations like that.

Plus, if he had never been on a traverse fall, nor seen one, perhaps he genuinely didnt know? Im sure Ive ran out a few traverses Ive been on... Im only a beginner by comparison to most but still...

I get what your saying, I just think its wrong to say that there are climbers who have NEVER EVER put themselves at risk of serious injury because they made perfect judgement the whole time. I think every climber must have made at least one bad call and they more than likely didnt fall off at the point of discovering how bad the decision was.

Thats my own take, maybe Im pessimistic but I think everyone makes more mistakes than they really admit.

I know I do.