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General Climbing Discussion

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Onsight, Flash and Redpoint? 16-Jan-2004 At 10:03:50 AM (removed)

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And a further comment:

Wolfgang eventually conceded that red/pink/whatever pointing a route that you've previously worked was the way to go for very hard routes because it was EASIER than yo-yoing - i.e. it would enable him and climbing in general to progress to imcreasingly more difficult routes.

This information is gleaned from Wolfgang's biography - A Life In The Vertical - a must read for any climber with any sense of history. From what is written, Wolfgang was an extremely ethical man.

I'm still not convinced of the style of the FA of Punks, but in 1985 it appears that Wolfgang still yo-yo'ed (real yo-yoing, not the bullshit hybrid that people have assumed it is now) routes, so it is entirely possible that the route was done in proper ground up style but with leaving the rope in place.

I've only yo-yo'ed one route - Orestes - when Gordy lowered me to the ground instantly when I fell (I wasn't expecting it and it scared the shit out of me). My ascent of that was far more difficult for me (i.e. I was made to work more) than It'll Never Fly to its left which I worked and red pointed. The routes are generally considered roughly equivalent in grade and I did Orestes when I was climbing better.

You should all give yo-yoing a route that you haven't been on before (and at your redpoint limit) a go sometime - it's really quite fun. Hard routes in true ground-up style.

Just remember, you can't even touch a hold once you've fallen. No cheating now ...