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General Climbing Discussion

Topic Date User

to A(id) grade or not to A(id) grade 17-Mar-2005 At 3:18:56 PM LittleMac

Message

On 17/03/2005 M8iswhereitsat wrote:

>>Surely the M grades would need to adopt something similar.
>They are already 'clean' by default, as technology has overtaken the hitherto
>lack of supporting documentation.
>I support this argument with the theory that most newbie aid climbers
>already have cams, and go out and buy hooks rather than hammers.

I would defend my arguemnt by saying there still are aid routes being put up which use hammers, so therefore the M grading system can not be clean by default.

And not to harp on a point but if we are to reatin our historical background as has been quite strongly agrued, routes such as Ozy would need two grades anyway, a first ascent grade (hammered ascent) and also a clean grade (hammerless).

And of course a free grade but thats not the argument here