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Prusik while abseiling - above or below device?


wallwombat

2-Aug-2012
9:22:18 PM

On 2/08/2012 IdratherbeclimbingM9 wrote:

>These are the reasons that I use a prussik backup from time to time.

I only have one - I use one when I'm shit scared.

Otherwise, I don't bother.

On 2/08/2012 One Day Hero wrote:
>Yawn. Anyone who's been climbing outdoors for 6 months should be able to
>prussic up or down a loaded rope, then perform a rescue on a stranded abseiler.
>If you've been climbing a while yet are incapable of doing such a rescue,
>you're probably pretty shit.

Totally agree.


ChuckNorris

2-Aug-2012
9:29:58 PM

When i'm shit scared or need to frig about I always use the wrap around the leg method.

I guess that puts me in the prussic below the belay device camp.


pezz

2-Aug-2012
9:33:37 PM

on the sub topic of "who carries two prussiks"

i carry two, but the only times i have had to ascend a rope i have only used one and my atc guide. guide onto belay loop in auto block mode and prussik above used with a sling as a foot loop

so on with a sub sub topic, whats your preferred method of ascending a rope(be it single or double) when you don't have jummars near by?


IdratherbeclimbingM9

2-Aug-2012
9:54:45 PM

On 2/08/2012 wallwombat wrote:
>On 2/08/2012 IdratherbeclimbingM9 wrote:
>
>>These are the reasons that I use a prussik backup from time to time.
>
>
>I only have one - I use one when I'm shit scared.
>
>Otherwise, I don't bother.
>
~> You have specialised in bouldering lately right?
Heh, heh, heh.

On 2/08/2012 pezz wrote:
>on the sub topic of "who carries two prussiks"
>
>i carry two, but the only times i have had to ascend a rope i have only
>used one and my atc guide. guide onto belay loop in auto block mode and
>prussik above used with a sling as a foot loop.

I carry at least two (usually 3 or 4 of differing lengths), but then again I also mostly trad climb.
In the last 10 years I have only used them twice. Once was after I took a fall into overhanging terrritory _{(thanks for the tight rope belay Muki!)}; and the other was after I spontaneously decided to abseil into a location to snaffle some booty!


Muki

2-Aug-2012
10:00:29 PM

No need to carry ptusiks if you have slings, most climbers have slings don't they ?


IdratherbeclimbingM9

2-Aug-2012
10:11:25 PM

On 2/08/2012 Muki wrote:
>No need to carry ptusiks if you have slings, most climbers have slings
>don't they ?
>
For my rack, I have found that 1" tubular slings don't make the best of prussiks on 9 mm double ropes!


trog

3-Aug-2012
1:50:10 AM

Yawn, yep people definitely should be able to.

But how many of the people you see at any given crag would you really want rescuing you?
How often do you see teams of one experienced climber and one pretty raw beginner or strong complete gym bunny?

Anyway... my point was just that unvarying black and white rules for this sort of stuff is lazy


ajfclark

3-Aug-2012
7:30:13 AM

On 2/08/2012 pezz wrote:
>on the sub topic of "who carries two prussiks"
>
>i carry two, but the only times i have had to ascend a rope i have only
>used one and my atc guide. guide onto belay loop in auto block mode and
>prussik above used with a sling as a foot loop
>
>so on with a sub sub topic, whats your preferred method of ascending a
>rope(be it single or double) when you don't have jummars near by?

It depends.

If the rope is weighted you can't use the grigri/guide and prussic/ascender method as you can't get the device onto the rope. So when you peel off seconding a roof and end up hanging free your options are limited to things that clip around the rope: prussics or I guess tiblocs or similar.

If I know I'm ascending a rope and setting up for it ahead of time I'll use the grigri and prussic method.


ajfclark

3-Aug-2012
7:31:21 AM

On 2/08/2012 Muki wrote:
>No need to carry ptusiks if you have slings, most climbers have slings don't they ?

Not necessarily when seconding a pitch as I've usually given them all to the leader. Depending on the ear the leader has placed I might not end up with what I need so I have my little private stash of prussics that I keep with me.


pmonks

3-Aug-2012
8:45:06 AM

On 3/08/2012 ajfclark wrote:
>On 2/08/2012 Muki wrote:
>>No need to carry ptusiks if you have slings, most climbers have slings
>don't they ?
>
>Not necessarily when seconding a pitch as I've usually given them all
>to the leader. Depending on the ear the leader has placed I might not
>end up with what I need so I have my little private stash of prussics that
>I keep with me.

Ditto. I keep two of them daisy chained to the same biner I carry my nut tool and whistle on (since I rarely if ever hand that over to anyone else).

One Day Hero

3-Aug-2012
9:17:36 AM

On 3/08/2012 pmonks wrote:
>I keep two of them daisy chained to the same biner I carry my
>nut tool and whistle on

Have you ever found yourself blowing the whistle furiously after encountering amateurs at 6 o'clock?


pezz

3-Aug-2012
10:32:04 AM

On 3/08/2012 ajfclark wrote:
>On 2/08/2012 pezz wrote:
>>on the sub topic of "who carries two prussiks"
>>
>>i carry two, but the only times i have had to ascend a rope i have only
>>used one and my atc guide. guide onto belay loop in auto block mode and
>>prussik above used with a sling as a foot loop
>>
>>so on with a sub sub topic, whats your preferred method of ascending
>a
>>rope(be it single or double) when you don't have jummars near by?
>
>It depends.
>
>If the rope is weighted you can't use the grigri/guide and prussic/ascender
>method as you can't get the device onto the rope. So when you peel off
>seconding a roof and end up hanging free your options are limited to things
>that clip around the rope: prussics or I guess tiblocs or similar.
>
>If I know I'm ascending a rope and setting up for it ahead of time I'll
>use the grigri and prussic method.

I have used a prussik and guide mode on a weighted rope when fallen and free hanging
Attach prussik with foot loop, slide up and step into it,
Attach personal sling(pas, draw ect) to prussik,
Sit into it and thread atc into the system,
Stay tied in whilst doing so. That way you have a backup to the prussik whilst seting up the system

Or did you mean the rope below is weighted?


ajfclark

3-Aug-2012
10:41:31 AM

That sounds like it'd work, but I didn't think of that at the time. Throwing two prussics on seemed pretty straight forward as I could just hang there and sort it out.


pmonks

4-Aug-2012
2:56:22 AM

On 3/08/2012 One Day Hero wrote:
>On 3/08/2012 pmonks wrote:
>>I keep two of them daisy chained to the same biner I carry my
>>nut tool and whistle on
>
>Have you ever found yourself blowing the whistle furiously after encountering
>amateurs at 6 o'clock?

Yes, but for some reason you and Muki don't seem to be able to hear it via the internetz. I may need a bigger whistle.

stonetroll

4-Aug-2012
12:37:57 PM

Prussicks are beautiful, prussicks are fun, prussicks bring joy and laughter to the world and i love them.

My beautiful beautiful prussicks . . . . oh how they bring back memories. The long dark one i had back up in north, she was a nice tight unit, no stretch in that one. And then i can still remember the way the thick red one would wrap around my old stiff rope and clench on just when i needed her most. Ahh they come and go, but the better you look after 'em, the longer they last.

Well, prusicks come in different shapes and sizes and they all have their own special qualitys and benifits. So there's nothing wrong with having 2 or 3 or more if you want at the same time. Myself, i'm a 3 prussick kind of guy. 1 for each occasion. But some occasion you have to have 2 or 3 at the same time, and there's nothing wrong with that.

Now where were we ? Prussick above or below device while abseiling ?
BELOW !!
With the prusick below, you have greater control. If she clenches up too tight, just give her a gentle carress and she will loosen off for you.
BUT !! if she's on top and clenches up . . . . . . . . . ! wowah ... she might clench up even tighter because your full wieght is on her.

However, choose wisely. Not all prussicks like to be below. If too large, ( i.e unable to clench tight and totally lock on before reaching the point where she kisses up against the descending device ) you will be let down buy her performance. If too small, ( i.e unable to wrap around a sufficient amount of times to create co-hesive friction ) you will regret ever picking her up.

For me, the best prussick below my device is a 98cm length of 6mm chord joined with a double fishermans knot which makes 31cm internal diam' loop. French prussicked around rap' line and attached to leg loop on harness via small lock gate 'crab. ( Key component is the small caribiner )

When i was out yesterday i tryed to get the prussick to touch the belay device to see if it would kiss up agianst it and fail. But beacause of the way i have it set up with pretty much zero free play, the prussick keeps clear of the device buy at least 40mm even in the Kundalini position.

n.b; i find the 310mm loop too be a perfect length for both single and double rope rappels, even with varying thickneses of ropes. On single = 4 wraps french prussick. On doubles = 3 wraps french prussick. Sometimes on skinny ropes i just "fine tune" the prussick length buy adding a loop around the caribiner as i clip it into the carabiner.


Ben_E

4-Aug-2012
3:24:59 PM

^^^
That was really quite something... Not sure I'll ever feel the same about my prusik ever again.


Richard

14-Aug-2012
12:10:48 PM

On 1/08/2012 kieranl wrote:
>There are hazards with both methods.
>
>When clipping it above the descender you can get into diabolical trouble
>if the prusik is too long and the knot locks out of reach. Apparently people
>have died in this situation.

Another good use for the Yates belay knife!

God, I remember that roof on Navarre.... Cheers

There are 77 messages in this topic.