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Chockstone Forum - Crag & Route Beta
Crag & Route Beta
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6:54:54 PM |
so I was running laps on Muesli at Morialta, its been about a year since I was last on it, and it seems that some of the holds have gotten better edges on them, and a few footers are a lot bigger than I remember - not to mention the chalk arrows pointing to the holds, as if the years of layered chalk wasnt enough of a givaway. So have I gotten better (which I dont think I have) or has someone gone and made it easier? ( which I really hope they havn't) |
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8:25:55 PM |
As if anyone would enhance Muesli - its a 16. Now to bolt it, that would really be something! |
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8:48:51 PM |
I haven't noticed any change on it in the 3 years or so that I've been climbing. Which holds in particular do you think feel more positive? The route 4m to the right had a few recent bits of vandalism, apparently. Extra G Connection and Geronimo's Cadillac (they share the same start) had a bit of chipping recently (according to a CCSA email). |
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9:52:39 PM |
the first half just before the first break, the flake felt sharper, like someone attacked it with a wirebrush or something, and the little footer right of the flake (below the traverse into extra g) looks double the size. Im probably being paranoid about the flake - but im pretty confident about the footer, which now looks like a good handhold for a more direct start to extra G. I know its only a 16 but due to the nature of most climbers at mori, it gets fallen on toprope more often than it sees ascents and I wouldnt put it past misguided beginners to chip, accidentally or deliberate. Ive caught people trying to chip (they called it 'cleaning') Balthazar, which is only a grade 12 at Mori |
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12:15:23 AM |
hmmm yeah the footer could well be the questionable hold on the "new" route mike refers to... | |||||
8:58:57 AM |
Muesli hasn't been enhanced, and neither has Extra G. The previously "enhanced" climb has lost a lot of its old holds, and every time I look at it, it looks a little harder lower down. Every time I try it, it feels about the same as before. I don't hear everyone passing reference to Arapiles being chipped regularly. The last time I went to Araps I tried a 16. It felt pretty easy. I know that Araps has a history of chipping. As Sonny Trotter said about punks in the gym. "A little chip. A little glue". I can think of numerous other examples of starred climbs in our climbing mecca that seem "enhanced". Perhaps some bumbly has been chipping Araps as well. Obviously, if one climb has suspiciously been chipped, then everyone suddenly become a chipper. | |||||
7:47:32 PM |
On 30/12/2008 foreverabumbly wrote: > the little footer >right of the flake (below the traverse into extra g) looks double the size. Is the foot hold you're thinking of in that quartz crystal seam? On 2/01/2009 Setha wrote: >hmmm yeah the footer could well be the questionable hold on the "new" route >mike refers to... If its a foot hold below the traverse to get onto Extra G, then I reckon it'd probably be too far to the left to be of benefit for the Extra G Connection/Geronimo's start. |
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11:24:17 PM |
I seem to remember folks saying that the enhanced hold on the alleged new route being a significantly larger footer for a move or two in extra g. Its been so long since I have climbed on that wall I can barely remember. If you want to know details contact Steve aka Boardlord or whichever of his numerous alias' that he's currently using... |
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12:28:56 PM |
Just to clarify: A "new" route was added in 2005 which climbed GC til the second bolt then moved L and went up the narrow strip between GC and Extra G. A bolt was placed in the upper centre of the wall which was reachable from Extra G. This route is recorded in the New Routes book in Paddy Pallin. Some time later it was noticed that (cruxy) holds on GC near the second bolt (where you would leave GC to do the new climb) were enhanced. Maybe this was associated with the new climb or maybe someone was finding the crux of GC a little too hard. Around the same time the thumbpress/gaston above the first bolt on GC was lost due to natural attrition. I believe there's been some refashioning of the hold since but that seems more justifiable than the above (and it's still tougher than it used to be). So you can still climb Extra G Connection and not feel too compromised! But this chatter about the lower part of Muesli has me worried and I'll be having a look asap. Steve Kelly climbed a direct start to Extra G about 8 years ago, the thin line about half way between Muesli and GC. I think he called it Special K. We should explain to Chockstoners that the Muesli Wall is probably the nicest and most popular little wall in the Adelaide Hills and there are 100s of climbers around here who would take a dim view of it being vandalised. |
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12:44:42 PM |
Just reading what I wrote, I'm not suggesting Steve chipped Special K, I'm suggesting a direct start for Extra G has already been done so there would be no point "creating" another. Modifying climbs affects everyone and the thought of Muesli or poor little Balthazar being chiselled is sickening. Please contact the CCSA or PM beefy (the pres) on this site with any concerns or details. |
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8:12:17 AM |
Muesli hasn't been chipped. I was on it last week. One mention of chipping and suddenly every route in the gorge has been chipped. There was a bunch of tick marks all over the footers on the lower section though. Please brush the tick marks off after you have finished working your route and if you need tick marks to locate the footers on a route with such large foot holds perhaps you need to go see the optometrist. In regards to the connection I will fess up and admit that it was me that ripped the hold off it, well the second time round anyway. The small gaston was loose for as long as I have been climbing. It then snapped off when someone else was climbing it. Then the 'new' hold that appeared in it's absence flew off when I was running laps one day.Too much cake. I have managed to climb the route using a pinch above where the old gaston was at grade 26 (GC was given 26 originally but was crazy soft for the grade. The connection is a stout 24.) all the routes that use this start are a little harder than before but the new move is rad, cool cross through from the pinch to a small hold. Like a cool woodie problem. I ditched the hold to save people from the temptation of creating a horrid glue job! Have fun with this. Craig |
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10:28:51 AM |
Thanks for clearing this up for me craig (and others), I admit it seemed to have created a bigger stir than I thought It would, the route did generally feel different to me. like I said earlier I was probably wrong about the flake, but after looking at the whole of muesli wall and seeing changes there, I was just wondering if it had moved left is all. I still think the toe sized footer looks bigger but im glad to see its just my paranoid imagination. Im glad the changes I noticed are the workings of time on such a well travelled route and not the quick changes created by accidental or willful damage. I llok forward to trying out the new sequence on GC (though I admit I probably wont get it, the previous moves felt hard enough for me as it is) |
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12:11:33 PM |
It'd be sad if someone wrote on here that they suspected Muesli had been chipped and there was no reaction! You did the right thing airing your concerns foreverabumbly. The crux tight little horizontal of Stench had its roof neatly removed a couple of years ago (I've checked that one), and that sure wasn't natural attrition. We're talking about another long-established classic climb of the Gorge. The crags are defenseless and we need to enhance the culture that it's not cool to chip (but I admit it will always happen from time to time). |
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5:28:25 PM |
Hi, As a new member of this route up between Geronimo's Cadillac and Extra G after working on it for most of a long summer. It was put up in May 2005 and I called it "Grurper's Skateboard" for obvious reasons. It was not subject to any chipping or modification. The only cleaning was digging some mud and a spider out of a single- finger crystal pocket up near the exit which was done with a tooth brush. At the risk of spraying beta around I would add... From my memory after the 2nd bolt on GC there is only one really hard, steep and delicate move up-right and from there it's an easy romp to the top. The route I put up goes from this stance near the 2nd. bolt diagonally left and up, over the prominent bulge in the centre of the wall between Extra G and GC which puts one (well, it does for me) into a skateboard style move with low hands on top of the bulge before continuing straight up the wall which is thin, steep and sustained until a tricky exit at the top. It avoids all of the holds on GC or Extra G except possibly of a couple of right layaway flakes as move onto the skateboard move although these holds would never be used in this direction on Extra G. If you come off here, you will hit the ground without pro (I measured it with a piece of string). Originally, when working on this I would traverse left off-route somewhere near the skateboard move onto Extra G to place a nut for protection but this really destroys the flow of the climb and is way out of the line. After much soul searching and not wishing to provide a route that might lead to someone's paralysis or death - I placed my first bolt in 40 years of climbing! It was certainly something I thought about long and hard and I still feel it was a responsible thing to do. It's a 10 cm stainless bolt hole, the hole is clean and precise put in with no fracturing of the surrounding rock. I've several years experience in rock drilling in the mining industry in a previous life. Clipping this bolt from Extra G is simply going off route! I graded the route 27 because I found it harder than GC. I climbed as many other grade 26 climbs as I could find around that time to compare and I think it stands but I'm happy to hear of any revisions. I've never heard of anyone climbing it and I would to hear some feedback. I reckon it's superior to GC, it flows beautifully and there are some exceptionally stimulating sequences and an elegant dyno move for a critical hand change somewhere! I did get a bit of flack for the bolt but I stand by my decision to place it. Having been up and down this route a hundred times I began to think there might be a direct start and I read today that someone has done this and called it "Special K". I too looked at a similar start, between Muesli and GC, which went straight, traversing Extra G connection and skimming past the end of the horizontal traverse from Muesli which goes out to the start of Extra G. I never managed to climb it but I always thought it might 'go' to someone stronger than me. I worked on it on and off for a couple of weeks and during that time noticed it was receiving other 'visitors' although I never saw anybody on it. Perhaps I left a tempting trail of chalk marks? It was about this time a noticed a small (~5 cms) horizontal crimp appear but it was off route for my line but would have been useful to link a direct start to it. From memory I think it was much too high to be involved with Extra G Connection so it remains a mystery to me. I'm not climbing anywhere near that grade now and haven't been up there in a while but would feel really pissed off if someone has 'added' to my route because this was the best route and certainly the hardest I've ever put up and cost me a couple of tendon ruptures in the process. I will go and abseil down and check it out now that I'm back in the country I recommend this route as one of the best in the gorge and would like to hear from anyone who has an opinion on it. grurper |
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9:39:39 PM |
Hey grurps welcome home. As a schoolkid the day I lead Grurper at the summit is one of the fondest memories I have of my climbing life. Grurper is one of the best climbs around - a diagonal offwidth full of bird crap, with a classic mantle onto a guano stained ledge. Given you speak so eloquantly about the best pieces of stone in the gorge. Can I ask you a direct question? Did you chip "the stench before the storm"? |
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1:54:04 PM |
Hi 'stugang' In answer to your question "Did you chip 'the stench before the storm?'" - an emphatic NO! My involvement with that climb (we're talking about the climb to the right of Japetus right - horizontal roof then up hard?) is referred to in my last posting. I started to go through all the 26's I could find to verify if the 27 grade I put on 'Grurper's Skateboard' was just. I used to climb mid-week with a friend called "Bob" - Plumb Bob actually. I would counterweight my rope with about 10-15 kg of lead ingots and as I climb up the weight comes down (frequently cracking my skull at the exact halfway point :-) and it takes in the slack cleanly as I ascend (and, if you arrange it correctly, using a twist around the dead rope in a sort of single turn Klemheist, it will grab the rope when you fall and release when you climb - [disclaimer - no guarantee this actually works is implied or given and it is not recommended by me] ). I worked on "Stench" over and over and got really frustrated with it because one move was bloody hard for me. Some details because I don't know where this chip is! The solo technique I used at the time prevented me from doing the roof start so I would lower to start right on the lip, feet in the air sort of thing, although when climbing with a partner a couple of times I did managed once or twice to do that desperate move out from under the roof, which from memory involved an undercling and high toe/heel hook above the lip of the roof up high to the right and a pinch crimp? My problem with the climb always came after ascending from the lip of the roof, up the little central prow and then finding a very high diagonally up/left layaway move which I just can't make - being about 12 cm short of the necessary reach. I tried everything and could and occasionally I could slap it on a failed dyno but couldn't stick it. Eventually, I worked my way around it by keeping to the right of the little prow and climbing the flat face on tiny crimps, coming back left on open crimps until below the base of the exit ramp. I always hated this damned thing and once I'd done it to my satisfaction I gave it away and it was f---ing my hands anyway! This was back in 2004-2005 and I haven't been on it since 2005. So, where's the chip - is it on the lip of the roof or, is up where I could make the move below the start of the rightward ascending ramp to the finish? I went up to Thorn Buttress when I got back from Switzerland in early November hoping to do some laps on Japetus because my upper body has wasted away having spent the last 15 months sitting at a friggin computer and Japetus is a blast to wake up your arms! To my dismay someone seems to have removed my counterweight I left at the top. If you know where it is I would appreciate getting it back. However, while I was there I see there seems to be some action on a climb just to the left of 'Sardine' which I know as "Pussycats and Kneecaps" or something like that, and that climb definitely seems to have been chipped quite strongly. Maybe I'm getting these two climbs confused? I hope this helps? grurper PS Are you being sarcastic about the climb of the same name? |
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4:13:41 PM |
On 30/12/2008 Mike Bee wrote: >The route 4m to the right had a few recent bits of vandalism, apparently. >Extra G Connection and Geronimo's Cadillac Are you telling me someone put up a route called Geronimo's Cadillac? I want their names so they can be ruthlessly pilloried for the common good. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bcNKOlAZeLw Hard to believe they were from the same country as Wolfgang Gullich! STB |
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6:39:14 PM |
On 12/12/2009 MisterGribble wrote: >On 30/12/2008 Mike Bee wrote: > >>The route 4m to the right had a few recent bits of vandalism, apparently. >>Extra G Connection and Geronimo's Cadillac > >Are you telling me someone put up a route called Geronimo's Cadillac? >I want their names so they can be ruthlessly pilloried for the common >good. > >http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bcNKOlAZeLw > >Hard to believe they were from the same country as Wolfgang Gullich! > >STB Yep. There's a route calld Geronimo's Cadillac. It's a well known test piece in Morialta Gorge. According the guide books, the FA went to Colin Reece and Mike Round back in '72. |
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8:18:58 PM |
On 12/12/2009 grurper wrote: >Hi 'stugang' > >In answer to your question "Did you chip 'the stench before the storm?'" >- an emphatic NO! > >However, while I was there I see there seems to be some action on a climb >just to the left of 'Sardine' which I know >as "Pussycats and Kneecaps" or something like that, and that climb definitely >seems to have been chipped quite strongly. Maybe I'm getting these two climbs >confused? >PS Are you being sarcastic about the climb of the same name? That's pretty amusing Grurper. Bringing Pussy Cats into the mix. Ha ha. It seems we will never get a straight answer on who did the manufacturing (to Stench) - and by now it's history, but one thing is for sure: whoever it was clearly lacked any vision, or at least any basic climbing technique. Anyone without a blindfold would realise that it can be climbed without the chipped hold at all - apart from the chipper obviously! They even wire brushed out the footers in the top section. My only surprise is that they didn't paint them green and rig an in-situ TR on it. |
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6:01:50 PM |
well that's good you're not the phantom chipper grurper because I can tell you there was a fair bit of aggro around when it was discovered that two of the best 26's in the Hills, Stench and GC, had been chipped and wire brushed needlessly. These little crags aren't Arapiles but they're not there for anyone to modify to suit themselves. Let's all keep our eyes and ears open. |
| There are 20 messages in this topic. |
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