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Tips for cliff development


Pat

9-Feb-2015
3:28:58 PM

I'm developing a new cliff and have come back from the last couple of trips absolutely knackered.

Main problems are coming from hanging in the harness for long periods of times cleaning up the lines.

Any tips on doing this work in a more comfortable way. Basically the setup was a grigri on a pretty good petzl harness.

Do people use bosun's chairs? If you do how do you connect them to the rope?


IdratherbeclimbingM9

9-Feb-2015
3:35:40 PM

On 9/02/2015 Pat wrote:
>I'm developing a new cliff and have come back from the last couple of trips
>absolutely knackered.
>
~> You sound like me, ie need to get fitter...
;-)

>Main problems are coming from hanging in the harness for long periods
>of times cleaning up the lines.
>
>Any tips on doing this work in a more comfortable way. Basically the setup
>was a grigri on a pretty good petzl harness.
>
>Do people use bosun's chairs? If you do how do you connect them to the
>rope?

I have not developed a cliff, but I have cherry picked off them...

I have done rigging work requiring hanging (at various heights on the projects), around all day... & all with (sometimes considerable depth), water beneath...
~> I found that a bosuns chair attached to it's own jumar was the way to go*, as this enabled fine tuning the 'hang' and enables being in-harness** comfortably as a backup. I also incorporated a chest harness to help combat fatigue.
The work involved a lot of drilling and my biggest problem was that to lean on the drill for extra oomph caused me to swing away from the work in hand.
(*I imagine that this could also be done with a two ascender technique.)
(** And this before I bought my U-beaut-big wall-comfy-harness!)

At the end of the day I was able to jumar out of the work environment easily without removing the bosuns chair, simply by pushing it ahead of the ascention jumar as a doubled arrangement.

dalai

9-Feb-2015
3:59:26 PM

Is this the one you posted a very average and small photo of a while back?

I've always just put up with the discomfort, but as M9 suggests a bosun's chair may work?


rodw

9-Feb-2015
4:01:35 PM

I tend to do it ground up ie jumaring up, using normal harness etc...gives more freedom of movement to stretch between activities .....the steeper the route the harder it is but plugging in any gear to keep you closer to the wall (or dogging bolts if none) makes it easier on the body...or use a chest ascender to save the back a bit.

All said and done though, its just hard work TBH

dalai

9-Feb-2015
4:07:40 PM

This one?

Jayford4321

9-Feb-2015
5:00:25 PM

On 9/02/2015 Pat wrote:
>I'm developing a new cliff and have come back from the last couple of trips
>absolutely knackered.
>
>Main problems are coming from hanging in the harness for long periods
>of times cleaning up the lines.
>
>Any tips on doing this work in a more comfortable way. Basically the setup
>was a grigri on a pretty good petzl harness.
>
>Do people use bosun's chairs? If you do how do you connect them to the
>rope?

Why not just ask any of the over-bolt spurt routers to do it for U?
Can't get more comfortable than that.


Pat

9-Feb-2015
5:08:49 PM

Thanks for the feedback guys.

In reverse order. No Dalai, the one pictured is for after these cliffs are developed. It's in a different location.

Will try the bosun's chair next time M9. Yes I am unfit, but would be happy to be as fit as you - then I would be able to eat raw lemons for wall food. I have a bony butt so it will need to be a well padded bosun's - think Jason recliner style.

Thanks RodW, we cleaned top down on gri gri so that we didn't need to jug and found that we were brushing our cleaning off twice (at least). Might try that so that the cleanings don't get snagged, but don't fancy the extra effort in jugging. Probably will add knee pads.

dalai

9-Feb-2015
6:10:38 PM

Nice Pat. Look forward to seeing details once finished.

9-Feb-2015
6:26:46 PM

*Use a big wall harness. The bigger the better
*Buy a static rope and use rope protectors. Saves so much energy jugging
*Learn to use small aid bolts. Saves heaps of time dicking around with dodgy gear/hooks. Skyhooks are also good in roofs when its juggy.
*If the rock is really really.... really ridiculously good, use Dynabolts instead of glue ins. Saves so much time.
*Don't clean too much vegetation. If its there now, it will probably find its way back to the cliff! This really should be rule #1


nmonteith

9-Feb-2015
8:52:41 PM

What Kent said. ^

Also wear thick long pants and use gloves if you are brushing a lot. Saves destroying your knuckles. I also find that having all sorts of crap clipped to you harness makes hanging there way more painful. Clip your drill or bag of bolts to your ascender direct when your not using it rather than hanging off your body.

Wendy

9-Feb-2015
8:57:13 PM

I think the tips for cliff development really are:

Keep it close to the car
Put in lots of bolts
Viciously overgrade everything
Invite Douglas up for the promo shoot. I will buy him some new gold lame hot pants for the occasion.

TimP

9-Feb-2015
9:18:36 PM

I saw a rope access full body harness recently that had the bosuns chair attached to the tie-in point. Not sure how to rig it on a climbing harness but if you got the lengths and tension right you'd be sitting whenever hanging from your ascender.

mikllaw

10-Feb-2015
7:34:16 AM

What is the number and quality of routes that have to be at a cliff to make it worth visiting?

It is some complex but well understood formula that includes walk-in length and the presence of bolts and belay bait.


Pat

10-Feb-2015
9:11:29 AM

On 9/02/2015 Wendy wrote:
>I think the tips for cliff development really are:
>
>Keep it close to the car

Check

>Put in lots of bolts

mmm . . . depends on what we unearth and I want to get my first bolting effort right - but I get your point 'Bolt it and they will come'.
>Viciously overgrade everything

Could be embarrassing having my viciously over-graded sixteen downgraded to an eight
>Invite Douglas up for the promo shoot. I will buy him some new gold lame
>hot pants for the occasion.

Not going to happen, - have my own hot pants and no one's going to steal the limelight

As for Mikl's formula, there must also be factor for proximity to Melbourne and how many better cliffs you drive past - don't you think?


nerm

10-Feb-2015
9:44:49 AM

A good option for a cheap and super light bosuns chair is a plastic kids swing seat from bunnings, if your arse can fit in it:
http://www.bunnings.com.au/swing-slide-climb-yellow-plastic-swing-seat-_p3320779


nmonteith

10-Feb-2015
10:45:30 AM

I must be quite efficient as I've never felt the need to use a bosans chair. I do use a big-wall harness though. I like to be able to test moves when I'm bolting - so want a bit of flexibility in the system. A bosuns chair just looks clunky and annoying.

TimP

10-Feb-2015
11:01:58 AM

I make these seats for a bosuns chair: 6mm hoop pine ply with 12mm PET felt for a bit of comfort, size varies, these are 460mm x 110mm, weight 310g. 4 holes for 6 to 8mm cord, best to tie it crossing diagonally under the seat to give a bit of movement - got this from actual bosuns chair, then knot all 4 stands at the top to clip in to. Will be experimenting to see if I can connect it to the main tie-in point on my harness.


Miguel75

10-Feb-2015
11:36:05 AM

I can attest to the quality of TimP's bosuns seat. They're comfy and very slim compared to the BD One.*

*Disclaimer; I have not received any compensation for writing this post. I have no material connection to the brands, products, or services that I have mentioned;)

Wendy

10-Feb-2015
1:21:56 PM

On 10/02/2015 Miguel75 wrote:
>I can attest to the quality of TimP's bosuns seat. They're comfy and very
>slim compared to the BD One.*
>
>*Disclaimer; I have not received any compensation for writing this post.
>I have no material connection to the brands, products, or services that
>I have mentioned;)

I am waiting for the promotional photos and tweets. I will expect a mankini.
and Pat, I am also awaiting yours #hotnewcraghotnewhotpants


Pat

11-Feb-2015
11:29:36 AM

My teenage daughters have enough ammunition to deride me with - so no mankind.

My plan is to undersell and slightly over deliver. So no hot new cliff.

The crags (there are actually four separate little cliffs) are more tepid than hot. I am a middle aged bumbly.

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