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Chockstone Forum - General Discussion

General Climbing Discussion

 Page 1 of 6. Messages 1 to 20 | 21 to 40 | 41 to 60 | 61 to 80 | 81 to 100 | 101 to 108
Author
More slackline anchors
Wendy
20/03/2013
11:28:08 AM
On 23/04/2012 One Day Hero wrote:

>As I understand it, they left the bolts, just took the hangers with them.
>Once it hits youtube, there'll be "repeat traversionists" appearing.........if
>you pull the bolts and fill the holes, be ready for the next crew to just
>drill fresh ones.

So it appears Damo has an uncanny knack for telling the future. Another slackline is in place above Eskimo Nell at the moment. The original bolts are still in place, but they have actually drilled a few new ones. So there are now about 10 bolts above EN. It's rigged to the top of Ice Cream Man, so I guess there are another 4 bolts over there.

The grumpy woman in me was tempted to take the whole set up. Does anyone have any idea who these people are and how we can get across the message that throwing bolts in willy nilly to rig slacklines in a state park is not acceptable?

shortman
Online Now
20/03/2013
11:35:20 AM
On 20/03/2013 Wendy wrote:

Does anyone
>have any idea who these people are and how we can get across the message
>that throwing bolts in willy nilly to rig slacklines in a state park is
>not acceptable?

Maybe?? Just this last weekend Wendy?
Wendy
20/03/2013
12:02:20 PM
It was there yesterday. I mean, they can slackline all they want if they really have to, but I am concerned that a stupid number of bolts has been put in for the exercise when there are no shortage of good anchors in the vicinity, not to mention, bolts previously placed for the same purpose last year!

shortman
Online Now
20/03/2013
12:59:50 PM
Check if the guys with the gibbon slackline set up are still in the Pines. Apparently you're looking for a group of 6-8 who may have bolting gear with them. Don't know them though, so can't really help.

sliamese
20/03/2013
5:07:20 PM
i guess its vastly different to all those bolts on the organ pipes for guiding? I agree its silly having 10 bolts, but disagree that they're less justified because you climb, not highline.

shortman
Online Now
21/03/2013
12:13:28 PM
Just out of interest - Did you find 'em Wendy?
One Day Hero
21/03/2013
2:07:13 PM
I suppose that climbers will have to negotiate with slackliners now about appropriate placement of bolts. However, slackliners don't even realise that they're involved in a negotiation, and even if you talk to this crew the next jokers who show up with a drill won't know anything about it.

Therefore I'd recommend pulling all their bolts and chopping the slackline into convenient 2m lengths..........that'll get the word out in the slacklining scene very efficiently :)

shortman
Online Now
21/03/2013
2:32:49 PM
On 21/03/2013 One Day Hero wrote:
>I suppose that climbers will have to negotiate with slackliners now about
>appropriate placement of bolts. However, slackliners don't even realise
>that they're involved in a negotiation, and even if you talk to this crew
>the next jokers who show up with a drill won't know anything about it.
>
>Therefore I'd recommend pulling all their bolts and chopping the slackline
>into convenient 2m lengths..........that'll get the word out in the slacklining
>scene very efficiently :)

Totally down with this Damo. I'll spread the word.
anthonycuskelly
21/03/2013
2:34:50 PM
ODH, I disagree, 3m lengths would be a bit more convenient for bailing with...
hotgemini
21/03/2013
2:51:47 PM
As much as it frustrates me with a new usergroup coming into an area and behaving in an inconsiderate way, I wonder whether it's worth considering a more pragmatic approach.

Eg. If we take it as given that we're not going to be able to get slackliners to adopt using trad anchors where available, rather than continue down the path of random hardware installation, chopping, reinstallation, etc.

Would it be more pragmatic to identify a selection of preferred highline sites and install appropriately robust and over-engineered anchors, so as to negate any desire from highliners to keep randomly scattering more bolts in every time a new group visits?

I'm 2000km away and certainly not going to be actioning these thoughts any time soon, but thought I'd put it out there as a discussion starter at least.

-Adam
kieranl
21/03/2013
3:40:15 PM
On 21/03/2013 hotgemini wrote:
>
>Eg. If we take it as given that we're not going to be able to get slackliners
>to adopt using trad anchors where available,
Why should we take this as a given? I know the anchor forces generated in highlining are large but I would have thought at Arapiles a good rock anchor would be stronger than a bolt (unless they're using 16mm or something). I'm sure it's more convenient to place bolts, and not too expensive if you take your hangers home with you, but there has to be some attempt at balance.

>Would it be more pragmatic to identify a selection of preferred highline
>sites and install appropriately robust and over-engineered anchors, so
>as to negate any desire from highliners to keep randomly scattering more
>bolts in every time a new group visits?
Look this lot are like climbers, they've found a motherlode at Arapiles. I anticipate that there will be lots more highlines go in at Arapiles. Have a google of "slackline arapiles": they're even naming their routes.
They're going to be another regular park user-group so when they do rubbish like this (spraying bolts on top of bolts on top of bolts) they need to brought into line..
hotgemini
21/03/2013
4:01:35 PM
I'm not saying we should, I'm just using it as a hypothetical axiom for the purposes of evaluating policy.

My reason for examining that possibility is driven out of a brief outsiders view of the apparent culture in slacklining, not out of an engineering opinion that using traditional anchors is unsafe.

Eg. We could fight a damaging and potentially unsuccessful battle to educate every prospective arapilisean slackliner, or we at least evaluate that whilst unpalatable, that it may be better to facilitate the artificial anchors for the activity to some degree.

I'm not saying this is the case, but rather that it at least deserves consideration.

-Adam.
kieranl
21/03/2013
4:16:06 PM
Leaving aside whether it's desirable, I don't think it's practical. I imagine setting up a new highline is much like working out a new route. First you have to visualise it, then work out the practicalities. Doesn't sound hard. Anyone can see the chasm between the Bluffs and Dunes buttress. Even there you have to work out the optimum sites to use.
So, first you have to get some highliners who know their stuff to go around and identify all possible highline routes. Then you stick in the anchors and say "No more".
Then someone else comes along and spots something else and does it.
It would be like bolting a sport cliff and then saying "no more", someone else is going to come along and want to do something else.
One Day Hero
21/03/2013
4:21:39 PM
There are differences between sport climbers and slackliners which should be taken into account when chopping their bullshit bolts. A couple of ringbolted slackline anchors have popped up at Point Perp which will probably have to be tolerated (and I don't think there are too many more spots for them down there, so it should be self limiting)

Sport climbers have;
-tens of thousands of dollars of established infrastructure out on public cliffs which can be attacked if you need leverage
-usually don't travel with bolting gear
-require dozens of bolts for a good day out
-have some vestige of respect for the rock
-take all their climbing gear home at night

Slackliners have;
-fuch all existing infrastructure
-seem to go out with a drill quite often
-can amuse themselves for days with only 6 or 10 bolts
-couldn't give a fuch about the rock except as something to anchor to
-often leave hundreds of bucks worth of kit strung up overnight

Chopping a dozen bolts isn't much of a deterrent. The next crew who show up will probably have a drill, won't mind spending ten bucks each on bolts (they can just treat bolts as a minor operating cost), and give no shit about drilling new holes next to chopped off stumps.

In conclusion, you don't have to chop a thousand dollars worth of bolts out of a sport crag very many times before the sport climbers will seriously lose their appetite for retrobolting trad crags. However, you can't get to slackliners via their bolts. Go after the slacklines they leave up overnight instead.

shortman
Online Now
21/03/2013
10:01:01 PM
On 21/03/2013 kieranl wrote:
>Leaving aside whether it's desirable, I don't think it's practical. I imagine
>setting up a new highline is much like working out a new route. First you
>have to visualise it, then work out the practicalities. Doesn't sound hard.
>Anyone can see the chasm between the Bluffs and Dunes buttress. Even there
>you have to work out the optimum sites to use.
>So, first you have to get some highliners who know their stuff to go around
>and identify all possible highline routes. Then you stick in the anchors
>and say "No more".
>Then someone else comes along and spots something else and does it.
>It would be like bolting a sport cliff and then saying "no more", someone
>else is going to come along and want to do something else.

How about a sign at the dunnies offering to educate the 'highliner' in the ways of approaching bolting and possible natural anchors at Arapiles? I reckon your right Kieran in what u say above and should be the one to educate. Someone will have to put in the hard yards.



shortman
Online Now
21/03/2013
10:19:19 PM
On 21/03/2013 kieranl wrote:

>Look this lot are like climbers, they've found a motherlode at Arapiles.
>I anticipate that there will be lots more highlines go in at Arapiles.

Again Kieran, you're on the money. Good insight.
kieranl
21/03/2013
10:21:32 PM
I'm happy to contribute. What if I draft a notice for Easter and put it up here for comment?

shortman
Online Now
21/03/2013
10:32:29 PM
Sounds like a plan.

Macciza
21/03/2013
10:44:01 PM
On 21/03/2013 hotgemini wrote:
> . . .
>Would it be more pragmatic to identify a selection of preferred highline
>sites and install appropriately robust and over-engineered anchors, so
>as to negate any desire from highliners to keep randomly scattering more
>bolts in every time a new group visits?
> . . .

I guess this is meant to work in the same way that 'pleasure bolters' are meant to stay away from trad lines and trad crags? Should work equally as well . . . .

Eduardo Slabofvic
21/03/2013
10:49:34 PM
On 21/03/2013 shortman wrote:
>
>
>How about a sign at the dunnies offering to educate the 'highliner' in
>the ways of approaching bolting and possible natural anchors at Arapiles?
>I reckon your right Kieran in what u say above and should be the one to
>educate. Someone will have to put in the hard yards.
>
You could put it next to their sign at the dunnies advertising their services

 Page 1 of 6. Messages 1 to 20 | 21 to 40 | 41 to 60 | 61 to 80 | 81 to 100 | 101 to 108
There are 108 messages in this topic.

 

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