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Trad Climb???
7:06:06 PM
Hey All,

As a first time user, I'd like to offer as a subject for discussion the question of 'fixed gear'. I hope it generates some interesting feedback and I'd like to apologise in advance to those who have already done the topic to death.

A friend and I climbed the first pitch of the very fantastic 'Trojan' the other day at Arapiles. The thing is, it's a trad route (though it has one bolt) but in the end I needed only to place two pieces on lead (at rest positions). I found there was in addition to the bolt three pieces of fixed gear in the route. With all this gear available it is very well protected. My questions are - why is there so much fixed gear? Does anyone have the history on the route and the reason for the fixed gear? It seems all that gear (except perhaps the crux nut) could've been place comfortably on lead or am I missing something? Should some of this fixed gear be removed - (controversial question)? And, why do I feel that I have climbed a sport route when I topped out?


7:11:50 PM
Some of the fixed gear comes form the days when it was an aid route. I imagine the bolt is part of this history - so it is propberly absolute crap and only in an inch or so.

7:12:24 PM
What has this got to do with an accident by the way???

7:40:41 PM
obviously someone **accidently** left gear on the route :P lol
10:42:19 PM
Trojan was a late-sixties aid route and it's hard to tell from your description how much of the gear dates back to then. Certainly the bolt would be sixties vintage. There used to be more but Terry Tremble removed one by slumping onto it and I don't know how many others there were.
As to the other fixed pieces: if they are pegs then they're probably aiding relics and might hold an eyelash more than a krab. Any wires are probably the remnants of sieging.
You say you had four bits of fixed gear and placed two pieces on Trojan? The fixed pieces on Trojan are time-bombs. IMHO you had two pieces that you could rely on on the pitch, the two that you placed yourself.
You've treated the fixed gear on a trad route as if it was placed on a sport-climb. The fixed gear on Trojan is not fixed protection by design; it's just crap that is left there.
That, I guess, is where the accident issue comes in, but I'm at a bit of a loss where to go with this because I can't really get a grasp on this misunderstanding.
You see, I look at Trojan and the fixed gear and I can write the gear off from the ground. Knowing that it's an old aid climb, I assume the gear is crap unless I know better.
Eddym has clipped this gear assuming it's good.
That's why it's a trad climb, eddym, because the fixed gear is shit.
11:45:42 AM
Oh shit! I've put this note in the wrong section... sorry about that - I was in a rush last night.

The gear actually looks good. Interesting that you are prepared to say it's shit while never actually seeing it. It is not aid gear and there are no pegs. It would probably be more informative for me if someone could respond who has actually seen the route and the gear I am talking about. Like, close...

Thanks for your concern about my safety and decision making though. I look forward to the next well informed lecture.

You can write gear off from the ground? Not bad. Especially considering how dark the crack is where the gear on Trojan is. I had to stick my face right in there and look at the gear from inches away before determining it's quality. But hey, what would I know, I've only actually climbed the route. Perhaps you could produce an article to explain to the rest of us how to determine the quality of fixed gear on routes from the ground. I'm guessing I'm going to need to add some reasonably good quality binoculars to my gear bag...(just joking).

Interestingly, the top piece (a hex with cord) has a shackle on it that seems to be set up to allow people to clean the pitch themselves without needing to second it. Don't know for sure. Would be a nasty pendulum if it pulled.

Sorry again about putting this in the wrong section. I'm new to this. We can move this over to the appropriate section if you like. Don't know how...


11:45:55 AM
Perhaps if they are crap old bits of gear then they should be ripped out??
11:49:34 AM
That's what I'm wondering...

People go around chopping inappropriate bolts. Why not inappropriate fixed gear?

I don't feel I am in a position to decide on either. Perhaps the Natimuk Faries might be the ones to decide on it. This is kind of where I was hoping this discusion would head.

11:55:12 AM

I'm going to re-initiate this discusion under the 'general discusion' forum - where it should be...

If you want to continue it move over there...

9:31:22 PM

That must be you!!

Checked the website. Nice photos!!

9:37:46 AM
Holy shit Simone!

How'd you guess? Hope Spain is still great.

There are 11 messages in this topic.


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