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Rave About Your Rack Please do not post retail SPAM.

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lightweight snow camping in Oz


Zebedee

6-May-2009
10:53:23 PM

On 6/05/2009 evanbb wrote:
>and she might feel warmer? So if someone is genuinely struggling you might
>be able to give them some of your heat, but if you're both cold this won't
>help.
I am sure if she was "genuinely struggling" that would produce some extra warmth, though perhaps some legal difficulties as well!

TonyB

7-May-2009
7:37:50 AM

On 6/05/2009 superstu wrote:
>I've never really liked the thermarests-style because they occasionally
>get punctured and you're in the poo.

I've had leaks happen on 2 snow camping trips and spent VERY cold nights. Now I take a 3/4 thermarest and a full length thin blue foam mat ... lighter and warmer than a full length thermarest ... and you can still sleep if the thermarest leaks. I stuff whatever I can find under my feet.
I use a small pack and tie stuff outside it to save weight.
Break your toothbrush in half.
Trangias are light.
Lightweight skis and boots make a big difference. An ounce on your feet is equivalent to a pound on your back. (I use old Alpina 2000 boots ... not made any more). Of course lightweight gear means you need to learn to tele much better.


IdratherbeclimbingM9

7-May-2009
11:19:47 AM

On 6/05/2009 Sabu wrote:
>On 6/05/2009 wallwombat wrote:
>>What are compression thermals?
>Another name for them is Skins. Can find them in any sport store. Basically
>they're
>really tight so keep you warm but wick away sweat to cool during exercise.
>What i like
>is that they form a super tight layer against your skin which is better
>than what you get
>for normal thermals.

Used to call it lycra once upon a time!
Hehx☺


Sabu

7-May-2009
11:25:02 AM

On 7/05/2009 IdratherbeclimbingM9 wrote:
>Used to call it lycra once upon a time!
>Hehx☺
SHHHHHH! :D

Richard Delaney

7-May-2009
2:18:44 PM

On 6/05/2009 another dave wrote:
>A megamid would let in spin drift if it was not properly protected. If
>you built a big enough snow wall around it every time you camped (so its
>great if you don't move camp often and the snow isn't rock hard) and you
>think it may storm it should keep spindrift out. You could also pile snow
>on the up wind side of the tent edge.

I'm now using my 3rd megamid (in 25years) and still swear by it as the best tent for
most Australian conditions. Even lashed out on a floor a while back so that my two
boys don't end up with their feet outside when there's 4 of us in there!

Re: snow walls, I've probably slept over 100 nights in the snow in a 'mid and found that
it's better to put a single course of snow blocks inside - when they're outside, the snow
piles up on the walls and tends to make things a bit squashy. In my post I did make
the proviso - "in the trees" as this gives far more choice for shelter/less exposure to
wind.

This tent should not be considered shelter if you're above the tree line. On the odd
occasion the wind has been up, sure a bit comes in:

But that's why I take a bivy bag as well.

>Have you considered a bivy bag. I have not used one though I understand
>thay are good for over night trips.
Sure are - good for emergencies if you do the base camp thing and ski the gullies/climb
some ice.

Re: T-rest vs foam - go the foam! (or maybe two if you can't track down a goodie - still
lighter than t-rest). I had a client step on his new thermarest once - only problem was he
had crampons on and ended up with 10 holes straight through both sides!


JamesMc

7-May-2009
5:19:26 PM

The trick to light weight snow camping is to do what they do everywhere in the world except Australia. Leave the tent at home and sleep in the huts. New Zealanders roll on the floor laughing at the Australian idea of always carrying a tent.

JamesMc

dmnz

7-May-2009
5:23:49 PM

On 6/05/2009 nmonteith wrote:
>Ridge rest is the most reliable comfy foam matt i've used.

second


Superstu

8-May-2009
8:08:27 AM

On 7/05/2009 JamesMc wrote:
>The trick to light weight snow camping is to do what they do everywhere
>in the world except Australia. Leave the tent at home and sleep in the
>huts. New Zealanders roll on the floor laughing at the Australian idea
>of always carrying a tent.

On the other hand huts everywhere in the world except Australia are maintained. Apart from a few lower altitude ones occassionally patched up by 4WD clubs, you may rock up to intended hut in poor conditions and find it uninhabitable, festy, or burnt to the ground.

I've heard unreliable reports that Bluff Hut burnt recently. Lovicks was removed at one stage, don't know if its been replaced. VG Hut is still there as of May 2008. With that sort of reliability do you really want to be skiing without a shelter???

Wendy

8-May-2009
8:35:36 AM

http://www.vhcha.org.au/
http://www.kosciuszkohuts.org.au/thehuts.html

These guys seem to be up to date with what's there and what's not.

TonyB

8-May-2009
8:48:33 AM

On 7/05/2009 JamesMc wrote:
>Leave the tent at home and sleep in the huts.

We used to have some great huts in NSW, until the useless idiots at Parks and Wildlife got involved. Albina hut was the ultimate in luxury.


Superstu

8-May-2009
10:31:11 AM

I believe there were two arguments for the case of letting the NSW huts turn to ruin. They were (a) promote wilderness ethos in the alpine region (b) encourage people to carry shelters for safety.

Both arguments are worthy of a long and winding chockstone thread.

For point (a), as much as I love exploring untracked & undeveloped wilderness, its a fanciful idea for a place that has stupidly resource-hungry luxury ski villages plonk in the prime territory, let alone the oh-so-eco-friendly snowy mts scheme and its associated roads and infrastructure.

For (b), there were several cases in which poorly equipped parties ran into trouble with fatal consequences, when the weather turned against them, visibility was lost and they were unable to locate the hut. The Europeans would say the problem lies in the huts not being properly signposted/tracked/poled/concreted/whatever, the Kiwis would probably say harden the f*k up, but in NSW the solution was a little more draconian.

Wendy

8-May-2009
10:54:38 AM

People wander around the mountains in europe carrying just a day pack. The huts provide shelter, bedding and food. So they are definately not carrying much for emergencies. WHilst we aussie dirtbags slog up to the hut carrying a weeks worth of food or possibly even a tent to park outside the hut, the french potter up with a tiny bag of rack, clothes and credit card only.

We have lost touch with natural consequences in our society. Normally they aren't quite as harsh as the natural consequences for not being prepared in the mountains, but really, what do people expect if they head off with no plans for being caught out? Even when hutting it, I cart a bivvy bag around.

If NSW parks wanted to follow their ideas through, they should be knocking the huts down (oh yeah, and removing the debris) - leaving them to fall to ruin just means that people go and stay in less than adequate shelters or turn up one year to find it's not even a shelter anymore. It's a bit of a half arsed stance. In a lets-blame-and-sue society, it could even leave them open to trouble.


IdratherbeclimbingM9

8-May-2009
11:03:51 AM

Wendy wrote;
>We have lost touch with natural consequences in our society.

... crazyjohn might dispute that statement?
(Heh, heh, heh).

>I cart a bivvy bag around.

I use one regularly and have found that they have their limitations.
If one wants to stay dry and warm camping during inclement weather they are only good for a couple of days and even then, involves judicious dodging of same (timing entry/exit from bag), in the worst of it, especially if out in the open.

If stuck in a three day blizzard you may survive with one, but you sure wouldn't be comfortable ...


Superstu

8-May-2009
11:07:40 AM

I reckon the status quo in victoria is the best. The huts are quietly maintained without much fanfare. They are not stocked with food, linen, etc and do not have a hut keeper to take your credit card. They are wonderful old buildings (often restored after fires to original designs) and I have had many great trips out with a small group of friends enjoying them.

If I rocked up to Edmunson's Hut in winter and found thirty people, a cafe/kiosk with register kachink kachink, I think I'd keep on skiing. You can get that at the resorts, why does the whole alpine area need to be developed like that?

Wendy

8-May-2009
11:19:41 AM

On 8/05/2009 IdratherbeclimbingM9 wrote:

>
>If stuck in a three day blizzard you may survive with one, but you sure
>wouldn't be comfortable ...

Well, it is only for emergencies and the odd super lightweight trip, I can count the nights out I've actually spent in it on my hands.


Cranky

8-May-2009
11:25:26 AM

On 8/05/2009 superstu wrote:
>I reckon the status quo in victoria is the best. The huts are quietly maintained
>without much fanfare. They are not stocked with food, linen, etc and do
>not have a hut keeper to take your credit card. They are wonderful old
>buildings (often restored after fires to original designs) and I have had
>many great trips out with a small group of friends enjoying them.
>
>If I rocked up to Edmunson's Hut in winter and found thirty people, a
>cafe/kiosk with register kachink kachink, I think I'd keep on skiing. You
>can get that at the resorts, why does the whole alpine area need to be
>developed like that?
>
I agree superstu, I like skiing in N.S.W. and I think the huts are a good balance of historic preservation, emergency shelter, and they are good to socialise in after sundown. I always carry a tent, because I like a quiet night and you can't always rely on getting to a hut or there being a spot for you when you get there.


nmonteith

8-May-2009
11:40:14 AM

On 8/05/2009 Cranky wrote:
>I always carry a tent, because I like a
>quiet night and you can't always rely on getting to a hut or there being
>a spot for you when you get there.

I just bring a hammer which usually solves these problems.


IdratherbeclimbingM9

8-May-2009
12:39:37 PM

>On 8/05/2009 Cranky wrote:
>>I always carry a tent, because I like a
>>quiet night and you can't always rely on getting to a hut or there being
>>a spot for you when you get there.

On 8/05/2009 nmonteith wrote:
>I just bring a hammer which usually solves these problems.

?
Nah.
I thought you were more a machette man ...
~> You are obviously expanding the rack!
☺

dmnz

8-May-2009
12:47:55 PM

On 8/05/2009 IdratherbeclimbingM9 wrote:

>>I cart a bivvy bag around.
>
>I use one regularly and have found that they have their limitations.

>
>If stuck in a three day blizzard you may survive with one, but you sure
>wouldn't be comfortable ...

No one I know carries a bivy for comfort. I'ts more a survival/weight thing and it doubles as a body bag too...


nmonteith

8-May-2009
12:48:34 PM

On 8/05/2009 IdratherbeclimbingM9 wrote:
>?
>Nah.
>I thought you were more a machette man ...
>~> You are obviously expanding the rack!

I had to get rid of that rather quickly a year ago... no reason... no reason at all....

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