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"Soft Catch" quickdraws

evanbb

11-Feb-2008
1:48:16 PM

Been watching a bit of "Committed, V1" lately and thinking about trad routes with only one placement. I think if I was doing that (which I'm not) I'd be tempted to use some sort of stretchy/shock absorbing quickdraw on the crucial piece. And now that I think about it, it would even be useful to carry one on a route that's got a particularly crucial piece.

Anyone had experience with them? I'm not really sure what's available either. Might have a look now.

EB

qman

11-Feb-2008
1:56:51 PM

"screamers" are a pretty widely available and common (i understand) in ice climbing.
They rely on stitching to rip to absorb shock.

Personally i would want a bigger margin of error. In E11 the guy breaks a wire or a cam in a big fall.

IdratherbeclimbingM9

11-Feb-2008
1:57:16 PM

There are at least two 'climbing brand' manufacturers of them not counting others who make them for industrial application / safety equipment.
Other threads deal with this and I will see if I can link, though the info tends to be buried within various topics.

The re-usable 'zyper' style of plate may be a better option for your application than the more expensive one off type of tear-stitch-webbing style of device.

>Personally i would want a bigger margin of error.
The industrial ones are made to self-deploy at various loads. You buy ones with the threshold that you desire, plus the amount of extension that you want.
Regardless of the initiating threshold, when they are used in combo with a dynamic rope/belay they introduce the crucial element of extra time into the dynamics happening. The additional time lets the rope do its work much more effectively thus reducing forces on individual protection components including screamer type items.

>In E11 the guy breaks a wire or a cam in a big fall.
Was it in combo with a screamer ?

qman

11-Feb-2008
2:12:18 PM

no there wasnt a screamer on it.

my point was really that i would prefer not to put so much reliance on one peice of gear, to the point that it may fail and needs a 'screamer'. in most situation i would like a back up (lower peice) to catch me if the primary blew (albeit with a huge fall)

wallwombat

11-Feb-2008
2:15:46 PM

I remember reading years ago in one of the American mags of this guy who made his own shock absorbing slings out of bit of tire inner tube. He would slice the inner tube up so he would have a rubber "sling" and then pair a couple of them up with a real sling a bit bigger than the rubber ones and clip a biner in both ends. The rubber inner tube slings would absorb a lot of the shock generated. I actually made one a few years ago, and it seem to work. I didn't use it and lost it before I got a chance to. The guy in the mag used it for ice climbing.

gremlin

11-Feb-2008
2:34:56 PM

Be a cheap skate innovative climber and just make one out of a length of a half rope?

Macciza

11-Feb-2008
2:58:40 PM

On 11/02/2008 evanbb wrote:

>Anyone had experience with them?

I use the Kong stuff - mainly the KISA. Works well, resettable rope device,
Have used it often on some routes of mine, falling and deploying regularly and not blowing gear . . .

If you only have one piece in, on an E climb you may as well have a load-limiter unless the extension is
more of a problem. Definitely worth getting if you frequent difficult or dangerous trad routes . . .

Of course -soft catch thin ropes an belay techniques are all part of the defense system as well

evanbb

11-Feb-2008
3:22:12 PM

On 11/02/2008 gremlin wrote:
>Be a cheap skate innovative climber and just make one out of a length of
>a half rope?

Yeah I guess you could knock something up fairly safely too. I was thinking something like a normal draw (my trad draws are slings rather than dog bones) with a second, say 4mm, cord looped with double fishermans knots. You could slide the knots apart and shorten the main sling, so that a fall would slide the knots back together, then at worst get caught by the original sling. I think that might work. Am I missing a safety consideration here?

wallwombat

11-Feb-2008
3:31:58 PM

The inner tube thing works well. It's simple and has been tested by the seppo ice climber that came up with the idea. Inner tube rubber is strong. Cut one up into loops and try hanging off one. You wont be able to break it.

gremlin

11-Feb-2008
3:37:32 PM

Yea the tire tube idea sounds like the winner tho...

Rich

11-Feb-2008
4:13:13 PM

those draws with roller wheel on the rope biner (can't be bothered looking for the brand) would work as a force reducing measure straight off the shelf - obviously a lot less effective than a screamer tho

dougal

11-Feb-2008
4:26:42 PM

Do you mean DMM revolvers? These are designed to reduce friction not increase it.

chalkischeap

11-Feb-2008
5:06:34 PM

The catch is noticably softer (at the harness) when you fall on a revolver. Also it doesn't wear the rope as much.

Another advantage is that you can almost run up the wall when pulling back up to your highpoint (rabid onsight trad nazis feel free to whinge about dogging etc)

evanbb

11-Feb-2008
5:54:26 PM

So I might combine some dodgy inner-tube engineering with some nice moder roller biners, for the ultimate in marginal placement technology. Give me something to do until my shoulder's functional again.

nmonteith

11-Feb-2008
5:57:18 PM

Maybe you could bring prototypes to Spurt Wall for the Serpentine weekend. Macca's friend will need every bit of help if he falls off onto gear in that choss...

wallwombat

11-Feb-2008
6:10:43 PM

Evan. Make one of the inner tube load limiters. As soon as you do, you will see that they work.

Cool Hand Lock

11-Feb-2008
9:49:34 PM

I have some screamers for sale. Pre-strung at no extra charge.

IdratherbeclimbingM9

12-Feb-2008
9:09:56 AM

ww wrote;
>He would slice the inner tube up so he would have a rubber "sling" and then pair a couple of them up with a real sling a bit bigger than the rubber ones and clip a biner in both ends.

Maybe a bicycle tube would be equivalent of an industrial screamer if it is narrow enough? ... a bit like tubular webbing.
Can see the advertising now; ... climbing spec bike tubes for the ultimate environmental off road adventurer!

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