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Chockstone Forum - Gear Lust / Lost & Found

Rave About Your Rack Please do not post retail SPAM.

 Page 2 of 3. Messages 1 to 20 | 21 to 40 | 41 to 50
Author
Backing up your belay loop

shmalec
12-Jan-2007
12:07:23 AM
backing up belay loops?
think about how many parts of the "system" are not redundant....pretty much everything except your belay anchor. the hot drill bit could just as easily burn/cut the rope or the waist belt on your harness. So should you wear two harnesses?
Take care of your gear, replace it if its worn out and try not to drill holes in it when in use.
I think this is a case of over accessorising. But "whatever floats your pontoon".

nmonteith
12-Jan-2007
8:09:05 AM
On 12/01/2007 shmalec wrote:
>backing up belay loops?
>think about how many parts of the "system" are not redundant....pretty
>much everything except your belay anchor. the hot drill bit could just
>as easily burn/cut the rope or the waist belt on your harness. So should
>you wear two harnesses?

I have leg loops that back up my waist belt.

kezza
12-Jan-2007
10:57:37 AM
There is a write up of what happened in Skinner's situation on the notice board at Cliffhanger, and him and his partner were fully aware that his harness should have been retired many months ago.

If you can't trust the strongest part of your harness, how can you trust any of your gear? If in doubt retire it, but if your having doubts about All harness belay loops, just solo.. or retire from climbing... Become a back seat climber..

Back up a belay loop, pfft!

dougal
12-Jan-2007
11:18:16 AM
Mr Monteith. You forgot blowtorch, small nuclear devices, cutting sarcasm and razor sharp wit:)

nmonteith
12-Jan-2007
11:18:18 AM
As a money savign exercise paying $10 for a bit of spectra to back up my worn belay loop is vastly
cheaper than a new harness every 12 months or so.

kezza
12-Jan-2007
11:30:21 AM
On 12/01/2007 nmonteith wrote:
>As a money savign exercise paying $10 for a bit of spectra to back up my
>worn belay loop is vastly cheaper than a new harness every 12 months or so.

Understandable Neil, but backing up a new belay loop? Or one that is in fair condition?

Would anyone back up a brand new belay loop? The craziness of it all! At what point do you back it up? Sounds like your playing with fire to me.. A bit of a hit or miss exercise, and the miss tends to end in tears.
By backing up your belay loop, you are trusting yourself to correctly attatch said backup, over the manufacturer's ability to design a super dooper strong belay loop?
Seems if it is backed up, more climbers will be using there harness to a point of failure and relying on one's untested home made belay loop!
Harnesses aren't exactly a super expensive piece of gear when it comes down to living for another day of climbing.

andyR
12-Jan-2007
11:40:27 AM
By backing up your belay loop, you are trusting yourself to correctly attatch said backup .... and relying on one's untested home made belay loop!

Kezza, we do that anyway: tying slings with tape knots, tying our ropes together with overhands (or plaiting them as Dalai suggests). If a climber can't trust their ability to tie a few simple knots correclty, then they should give up the game. Developing such competencies is integral to trad climbing. Tying a sound knot in a loop of spectra is a skills any competent climber should be able to execute. andyR

skink
12-Jan-2007
11:46:34 AM
On 12/01/2007 andyR wrote:
>Kezza, we do that anyway: tying slings with tape knots, tying our ropes
>together with overhands (or plaiting them as Dalai suggests). If a climber
>can't trust their ability to tie a few simple knots correclty, then they
>should give up the game. Developing such competencies is integral to trad
>climbing. Tying a sound knot in a loop of spectra is a skills any competent
>climber should be able to execute. andyR

Exactly my point - trust.

If you don't trust something as simple and bombproof as a belay loop, then how on earth do you bring yourself to trust knots?

skink
12-Jan-2007
11:49:23 AM
especially knots in spectra -eeek

andyR
12-Jan-2007
11:56:16 AM
Good to see this discussion developing, which after all was the whole idea of starting this thread! Thanks to all of you for the ideas you have contributed. It's good to read well thought out strong opinions which don't degenerate into character assassination and vitriol! We all have our own ideas and its good to share them in robust discussion. Cheers, andyR

kezza
12-Jan-2007
12:13:27 PM
On 12/01/2007 andesite wrote:
>If you don't trust something as simple and bombproof as a belay loop,
>then how on earth do you bring yourself to trust knots?

exactly!

yeah ok we should be able to tie a simple knot andyR, but we should also be able to inspect our harnesses on a regular basis! A back up would encourage the use of a harness beyond it's reasonable life. I can see the convo going something like "my belay loop is looking pretty dodgy, ah well she'll be right, I've backed it up!"
Argh!

>On 12/01/2007 andyR wrote:
>>If a climber can't trust (snip) then they should give up the game.


IdratherbeclimbingM9
12-Jan-2007
12:22:01 PM
>convo going something like "my belay loop is looking pretty dodgy, ah well she'll be right, I've backed it up!"

My axe is still good as new.
Had it for 40 years now.
Nothing wrong with it.
Mind you I have only replaced the head once and the handle about a half dozen times.
:P (tongue in cheek icon!)
Heh. heh. heh.

Phil Box
12-Jan-2007
12:30:19 PM
On 12/01/2007 andyR wrote:

>It's good to read well thought out strong opinions which don't degenerate
>into character assassination and vitriol!

We can change that ;))

nmonteith
12-Jan-2007
12:47:21 PM
In the end of the day i probably use my harness 10x more than most average climbers do. I am jumaring
up and down, drilling, photographing, scrubbing and generally destroying my gear at a rapid pace every
weekend and a couple of times durign the week. I am pretty famous for destroying anything in a short
amount of time. I find an average belay loop on harness wears out in less than 6 months - so i install my
own backup loop which means the 'wear' on the harness is lengthened considerably. I don't see any
negative reasons why a backup loop is a bad thing, and i see heaps of positives (like my life!). Im not
sure why people are so heavily against them??

nmonteith
12-Jan-2007
12:51:28 PM
...ask James @ Bogong about my abuse of gear! They currently supply me with harnesses!

mousey
12-Jan-2007
12:57:23 PM
is it Bogong where they have your picture behind the counter Neil?
the one that says 'DO NOT GIVE THIS MAN WARRANTY'

nmonteith
12-Jan-2007
1:04:58 PM
yes. i am not allowed to return shoes especially. :-(

IdratherbeclimbingM9
12-Jan-2007
1:35:19 PM
>Bogong
Is this spam?
Have you declared your pecuniary interests nm?
Do you have a product disclosure statement available?
Will this affect your premium?
If this information is not correct dial %$ to confirm!
:)
(Sorry, just backed up my house insurance and am still affected by it)
:(
Heh, heh, heh.
kieranl
12-Jan-2007
4:50:04 PM
On 11/01/2007 dalai wrote:
>I didn't think it would be understandable as it's impossible to describe
>and I wasn't told a name. So I wouldn't know where to start to search for
>pictures. I will have to show you one day!
>I was shown this in person once years ago, practiced a fair bit and finally
started using it!
>Was a pretty scary abseil that first time...
>Edit: But it is an easy way to abseil with a gri gri on a single strand.
I also don't know what it's called but another use for the technique is to help rope-recovery if you're short of slings and have a high friction anchor point (big bollard say). You don't have half the weight of the rope creating extra friction to pull against. Also reduces rope burn during rope recovery if rapping off trees. Big disadvantage is if the rope doesn't come down you can't tie one end of the rope off and jug the other side.
dalai
12-Jan-2007
5:37:21 PM
On 12/01/2007 kieranl wrote:

>I also don't know what it's called but another use for the technique is
>to help rope-recovery if you're short of slings and have a high friction
>anchor point (big bollard say). You don't have half the weight of the rope
>creating extra friction to pull against. Also reduces rope burn during
>rope recovery if rapping off trees. Big disadvantage is if the rope doesn't
>come down you can't tie one end of the rope off and jug the other side.

If people used this knot abseiling down from the Pillars of Hercules, the pillars wouldn't have all those burn marks and people would save a lot of effort by not having to drag 50 metres of rope around them.

 Page 2 of 3. Messages 1 to 20 | 21 to 40 | 41 to 50
There are 50 messages in this topic.

 

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