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Rave About Your Rack Please do not post retail SPAM.

Author

Buying a Trad Rack

martym

4-Feb-2014
1:16:57 AM

On 3/02/2014 SydneyBattler wrote:
>I'll probably go with a plain Vanilla rack = BD C4s, two sets of WC Rocks,
>and maybe I'll spoil myself on some TCUs.

The next step is learn what your gear can do...

A knuckle sized crack would probably fit a red cam;
The blue cams should fit where your fist can;
IF you can't get a finger in the crack it's definitely time to pull the nuts out.
How are you going to arrange them on your harness? Gear up front, draws out back?
Do you want to put a quickdraw on every cam? More weight but more convenience...

The other thing to consider is dual vs single axel - and this is where the (as yet unmentioned) link cams provide a nice addition to a rack.
Single Axel cams pivot so the lobes stay put; where as dual axel cams bend and thus put more pressure on the placement.

So much gear talk... must be Monday...


shiltz

4-Feb-2014
8:24:16 AM

Yep, don't get two sets of WC rocks. Just get one set and make the second set DMM wallnuts or Black Diamond. The small difference in size and shape is really handy.

Wendy

4-Feb-2014
9:01:11 AM

On 4/02/2014 martym wrote:

>
>A knuckle sized crack would probably fit a red cam;

What???? How big are your fingers? That's a hand crack!

>
>The other thing to consider is dual vs single axel - and this is where
>the (as yet unmentioned) link cams provide a nice addition to a rack.

I love my link cams. But I'd still suggest starting out on a simpler, more fool proof, not to mention cheaper, cam.

>Single Axel cams pivot so the lobes stay put; where as dual axel cams
>bend and thus put more pressure on the placement.

Dual axle in the mid to large sizes every time. Only my sub purple camalot cams are single axle. Stable, good range, reasonably fool proof. On the micro front, I vote for yellow and green aliens, grey, purple and green c3s, blue master cam. You can get away with out any of those for a long time if you aren't climbing 20+ as well, then i'd start with the 2 aliens.
>

Wendy

4-Feb-2014
9:05:11 AM

On 4/02/2014 shiltz wrote:
>Yep, don't get two sets of WC rocks. Just get one set and make the second
>set DMM wallnuts or Black Diamond. The small difference in size and shape
>is really handy.

Meh, I've climbed on a double (occasionally triple) set of wc rocks for 25 years. I like the consistancy and rather not, oh shit, i've use my only 5 rock already ... It's like the offsets argument. Once in a blue moon I might find a slightly better placement with an offset of a different brand, but no where near enough to justify carrying them.


nmonteith

4-Feb-2014
9:53:17 AM

On 4/02/2014 Wendy wrote:
>Meh, I've climbed on a double (occasionally triple) set of wc rocks for
>25 years. I like the consistancy and rather not, oh shit, i've use my only
>5 rock already ... It's like the offsets argument. Once in a blue moon
>I might find a slightly better placement with an offset of a different
>brand, but no where near enough to justify carrying them.

Each to their own. From my experience having two different brands on a rack is very useful. My choice is a single set of normal WC rocks and half a set of Offsets. For me I would say a quarter of the time I can not make a normal WC fit snugly, and then try the Offset option and that works way better. Especially on podded cracks found at Araps, Gramps and Point Perp. Offsets are not very useful at places like Frog or the Bluies with a majority of parallel cracks.

Howsie

4-Feb-2014
1:08:18 PM

Just like Robbio, Im a big fan of the extendable slings, also called alpine slings, look it up on u-tube.

Also a fan of the DMM dragon cams with their extendable slings as then I dont need anywhere near as many quick draws.

One Day Hero

4-Feb-2014
4:26:36 PM

Lets have a game. Imagine that you are on a road trip to The Blueys and Pt. Perp and wish to climb the trad and mixed classics up to gr20. You have as many draws, slings, and bolt plates as required but can only take 20 pieces of natural gear. Which 20 pieces do you take to climb the ticklist below (including belays) with minimal whimpering? Give reasons (routes) which inform your choices. No linkcams allowed!

Blueys-
Spartan, Joseph, Eternity, Carthaginian , Psychopath, Flake Crack, Amen Corner, Soloman, Gemini, Clockwork Orange, Interstate 31, Obituary, Telstar, Kaladan

Point Perp-
Over the Yardarm, The Deeps, Little Red Riding Hood, Bad Luck Streak, Grey Mist, Man Overboard, Windjammer, Icebird

Feel free to add in any classic easyish trad routes I've missed (which sane people actually aspire to climb), especially if it makes the game harder :)


shiltz

4-Feb-2014
5:32:37 PM

Climbing mostly in Victoria I haven't been on all these routes...
But, if I was on a road trip and could only bring 20 pieces I'd probably pick the following from my existing rack:
Wild Country Rocks - sizes 1 - 10
Black Diamond Camelots - 0.3, 0.5, 0.75, 1, 2, 3, 4
Wild Country Friends - 1, 2, 3


shiltz

4-Feb-2014
5:43:00 PM

The only significant difference between this and a normal trip would be I'd normally have DMM Wallnuts 1 - 10 as well.

Ignoring the budget of 20 pieces completely for a moment...
Heading to Araps I'd normally throw in some small stuff as well: a set of RPs and some small Aliens.
Heading to the Grampians or Buffalo I might add some big gear if my tick list warranted it (e.g. Passport to Insanity, Monarch): Black Diamond Camelots 5 and 6

Dave_S

4-Feb-2014
6:19:37 PM

On 3/02/2014 martym wrote:
>Two months at Araps - you'd probably want
>something more specialised including RPs and a size 6 cam or two.

What are you climbing at Araps that requires two size 6 cams?

On 4/02/2014 nmonteith wrote:
>For me I would say a quarter of the time I can not make
>a normal WC fit snugly, and then try the Offset option and that works way
>better.

Interesting. I'd say that a quarter of the time I can't make a DMM offset fit snugly, and a straight nut fits better!


Miguel75

4-Feb-2014
6:33:40 PM

On 4/02/2014 One Day Hero wrote:
... SNIP...
>You have as many draws, slings, and bolt plates as required but can only take
>20 pieces of natural gear. Which 20 pieces do you take to climb the ticklist
>below (including belays) with minimal whimpering? Give reasons (routes)
>which inform your choices. No linkcams allowed!

Can I climb in a loincloth and trade pieces of clothing for more gear on a 1 for 1 swap?

One Day Hero

4-Feb-2014
10:40:12 PM

On 4/02/2014 Miguel75 wrote:
>Can I climb in a loincloth and trade pieces of clothing for more gear
>on a 1 for 1 swap?

You want to start in just a loincloth, and then trade clothing for gear?


Miguel75

4-Feb-2014
11:56:40 PM

On 4/02/2014 One Day Hero wrote:
>On 4/02/2014 Miguel75 wrote:
>>Can I climb in a loincloth and trade pieces of clothing for more gear
>>on a 1 for 1 swap?
>
>You want to start in just a loincloth, and then trade clothing for gear?

Mmmm, I could have written that a little better;) Either way, do nipple clamps count as clothing?

martym

5-Feb-2014
12:07:11 AM

On 4/02/2014 Dave_S wrote:
>What are you climbing at Araps that requires two size 6 cams?

Having two size 6s on Watchtower would make you feel slightly safer than sliding it 20m up as you progress.... Not that i own one..

martym

5-Feb-2014
12:08:16 AM

On 4/02/2014 Wendy wrote:
>On 4/02/2014 martym wrote:
>>A knuckle sized crack would probably fit a red cam;
>
>What???? How big are your fingers? That's a hand crack!

Where are your knuckles?


Drake

5-Feb-2014
8:35:25 AM

>On 4/02/2014 martym wrote:
>>A knuckle sized crack would probably fit a red cam;
>
>What???? How big are your fingers? That's a hand crack!

The red alien could be knuckle sized, or the red #4 metolius could be ~2 knuckles.


IdratherbeclimbingM9

5-Feb-2014
10:48:39 AM

On 3/02/2014 One Day Hero wrote:
>-Lastly, this gear lives for a very long time, I'm still using my first
>rack which I bought in the mid 90's. I'd be pretty sceptical about saving
>a couple of hundred bucks by buying second tier crap. Unless you find stuff
>amaaaazingly cheap, stick with DMM, Black Diamond, Wild Country, Metolius,
>maybe one or two other quality brands

&
On 3/02/2014 nmonteith wrote:
>As Damo said - make sure the brands are mainstream and the gear is near new if buying second hand. Don't buy 80s hexes or fixed stem cams or anything from the East (Europe or Asia!).

ODH is right about protection potentially lasting a long time.
Last Aust Day w/end crazyjohn noted with interest my rack containing rigid stem friends alongside of linkcams and tape-version tricams alongside corded hexs on my rack bandolier...

Second tier is not a phrase I have come across before in regards to climbing equipment, but I get where you are coming from.
There is generally nothing wrong with using old gear, as long as it is used within its limitations (if the piece has any), or you are a shiny&lightweightgearfreak above all else!
;-)

Replacing consumables like slings on cams is a sensible precaution, especially if you don't know the history of the pro concerned.

If one stays in the game long enough, they will notice fashions come and go with the gear concerned. It can be a frustration if trying to keep matched sets when replacing equipment for whatever reason, especially colour coding of equipment, as over time items become unavailable when you may need them.
Fortunately I have noticed that common sense (equipment wise) usually prevails in the end. A classic case of this was when quickdraws became the 'current fashion flavour'. There was a period when one couldn't buy longer sewn slings for love nor money because they simply weren't available*. In fact the trend went even shorter with dog-bone style draws gaining fashion status, but after a while popular demand saw the reintroduction of long and 'double-length' slings, because they actually work well in lots of climbing applications...
When technology upgraded those longer sewn slings to being available in thin spectra style, it met the need of both traditional usage along with the shiny&light climber's requirements!

(* It was even hard to track down 1" tubular tape for a while back then, to tie your own slings).


nmonteith

5-Feb-2014
11:03:53 AM

On 5/02/2014 IdratherbeclimbingM9 wrote:
>Second tier is not a phrase I have come across before in regards to climbing
>equipment, but I get where you are coming from.
>There is generally nothing wrong with using old gear, as long as it is
>used within its limitations (if the piece has any), or you are a shiny&lightweightgearfreak
> above all else!
>;-)
>
>Replacing consumables like slings on cams is a sensible precaution, especially
>if you don't know the history of the pro concerned.

It's not just slings that wear out. Any form of "wire" - either on a nut or a cam, will eventually break. Sometimes with a lack of warning. Wires get bent backwards and forwards over edges and the steel eventually fatigues and fails. This is no a hypothetical situation - I've had it happen with wires and cams that were 10+ years old.

kieranl

5-Feb-2014
11:11:10 AM

You might have a bit of trouble buying WC Rocks at present due to the recent recall. The shops aren't getting supplies until people get their replacement wires. This situation will probably be remedied soon though (if it hasn't been already, over a week since I tried to buy some at my local shop)


Doug

5-Feb-2014
11:20:36 AM

On 5/02/2014 kieranl wrote:
>You might have a bit of trouble buying WC Rocks at present due to the recent
>recall. The shops aren't getting supplies until people get their replacement
>wires. This situation will probably be remedied soon though (if it hasn't
>been already, over a week since I tried to buy some at my local shop)

Steve at Rock Hardware has sets of Wallnuts (1-11) on sale for $179 at the moment:
http://www.rockhardware.com.au/Order.asp?Action=Group&MainGroup=Passive%20Protection&Category=DMM%20Wallnuts
Work really well on most rock, and brilliant at Mt Arapiles.

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