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Factor 2


gordoste

27-Apr-2010
3:55:06 PM

On 22/04/2010 kayakerSteve wrote:
>>If I understand correctly then that means the rope goes from your belay
>>device, through the top piece of gear and then to the second. Personally
>>I would avoid this because if the second falls, the load will all be
>on
>>that top piece of gear and it will be doubled (due to 2 load-bearing
>strands
>>of rope). If it pops you're in a bad situation - you'll have one less
>piece
>>of gear in your anchor which could result in shock loading due to extension
>>(depending on how you set it up) and will almost definitely result in
>your
>>anchor being loaded in a different direction than you expected.
>
>If you are belaying a 2nd properly from above, there should not be enough
>slack rope out to cause any serious shock to a belay.
>If they have to rest the load is dispersed by the anchor and not the harnes
>of the belayer.
>I made the mistake of belaying directly off my harness once, when my 2nd
>rested i was in a very uncomfortable position pinned to the rock, and could
>not offer any assistance. I will always belay through a high point when
>I can.

What I'm saying is that the force on that high piece will be twice the 2nd's bodyweight if they rest. So if they weigh 70kg, and you have the rope totally tight when they fall, it will be 1.4kN, but this is the absolute best case scenario. If they fall unexpectedly then it will be higher. If that piece isn't quite as good as you thought, you might be in a very bad situation, because the 2nder will then fall quite a way.
A better solution to this problem is to belay from below the anchor with the rope running through a carabiner attached to the powerpoint. That way the load will be on more than one piece.

patto

27-Apr-2010
4:28:02 PM

This is one thing that I find odd. People going to all the trouble of building a redundant and equalised anchors and then choosing the subject single pieces of that anchor to high loads.


IdratherbeclimbingM9

27-Apr-2010
10:47:09 PM

On 27/04/2010 one day hero wrote:
>.....more GOOD gear! Extra cams in slippery downward flares would have
>had a similar negligable effect on removing energy from the fall (outpedanted!)

Hmm.
On that topic, here is an interesting clip I found on the qurank acco section where three cams stripped off Erg at Frog.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UFUGHeq3SoI&feature=player_embedded

grangrump

28-Apr-2010
11:27:33 AM

I always found it curious that (with respect to Fall Factor), it was better to have all that slack pulled up as you fail to clip the first bolt and crater off (i.e. changes from a FF of 2 to say FF 1.5 if say 2 m up with 2 m slack).

It never feels that way!

Similarly if I fell off halfway up Mt Theory (all overhanging, no ledges, no trees) while setting up a self belay system, I could fall 60 m with a mere FF of 1 (yes both ends were tied in...)

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