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Interesting fall in Yosemite.


Miguel75

6-May-2013
4:06:49 PM

Saw this over on Mountainproject.com;

http://mountainproject.com/v/gear-failure-on-west-face-leaning-tower-results-in-whipper/108127111

Evidently the fall included one piece unclipping and 2 biners breaking, leading to a 55ft (FF2) fall....

argos44

6-May-2013
7:33:50 PM

Wow. Time for them to buy a lotto ticket!

Trad draws and cross-loaded binders, thats something to think about. Did the grigri help brake those biners because of a harder 'catch' or did it just save him?

kieranl

6-May-2013
8:11:11 PM

On 6/05/2013 Miguel75 wrote:
>Evidently the fall included one piece unclipping and 2 biners breaking,
>leading to a 55ft (FF2) fall....
>
>
The fall may have been twice the length of rope out but breaking the biners will have absorbed some kinetic energy (how much is anyone's guess) so not FF2. Still not one I'd like to take.
And can anyone enlighten me on what is meant by a "trad" draw? I hadn't realised that there were trad and sport sects within the draw community.

technogeekery

6-May-2013
8:19:54 PM

"trad draw" is what we call a runner... an open sling with 2 karabiners for extending pro.

That is a bizarre story... Can't conceive how one piece unclips itself and two others break their rope-side biners.


Ben_E

6-May-2013
8:21:47 PM

On 6/05/2013 kieranl wrote:

>And can anyone enlighten me on what is meant by a "trad" draw? I hadn't
>realised that there were trad and sport sects within the draw community.

Extendable draw/two biners on a shoulder-length sling. I assume you get that and are just objecting to the term, though. I prefer the term "slow-draw". :-)

Oddly enough, I had a partner pull gear on that same pitch after back-cleaning a few pieces and take a nasty fall - we ended up having to rap the route from the start of the 7th pitch (not fun given it's overhanging) and head back down the talus slope with her ankle rogered (also not fun - especially for her).

I still want to get back on it and finish the route...

kieranl

6-May-2013
8:28:07 PM

On 6/05/2013 Ben_E wrote:
>On 6/05/2013 kieranl wrote:
>
>>And can anyone enlighten me on what is meant by a "trad" draw? I hadn't
>>realised that there were trad and sport sects within the draw community.
>
>Extendable draw/two biners on a shoulder-length sling. I assume you get
>that and are just objecting to the term, though. I prefer the term "slow-draw".
>:-)
No, I can't recall noticing the term before. I wondered whether they were referring to a draw with solid rather than wire gates. So a sling? Why use 2 words when 1 will do?

technogeekery

6-May-2013
8:37:12 PM

"sling with 2 biners" = 4 words. "Trad draw" = 2. Get with the program, grumpybum. :P

This is what happens when you spend your life climbing instead of on climbing forums, you don't notice the language changing around you - and all of a sudden you are your father :-)

kieranl

6-May-2013
8:45:58 PM

On 6/05/2013 technogeekery wrote:
>"sling with 2 biners" = 4 words. "Trad draw" = 2. Get with the program,
>grumpybum. :P
>
>This is what happens when you spend your life climbing instead of on climbing
>forums, you don't notice the language changing around you - and all of
>a sudden you are your father :-)
>
Not at all grumpy, just curious. Wonder how it started and why the need for a new term?


nmonteith

6-May-2013
10:02:30 PM

If its any consolation Kieren, I'd never heard of that term either.


Miguel75

6-May-2013
10:04:24 PM

On 6/05/2013 kieranl wrote:
>On 6/05/2013 Miguel75 wrote:
>>Evidently the fall included one piece unclipping and 2 biners breaking,
>>leading to a 55ft (FF2) fall....
>>
>>
>The fall may have been twice the length of rope out but breaking the biners
>will have absorbed some kinetic energy (how much is anyone's guess) so
>not FF2.

Yeah a real FF2 likely wouldn't occur in 'real life' due to human squishiness and a lot of other factors but most people still usually refer to a fall that is double the legth of the rope out as a FF2.

>Still not one I'd like to take.

Amen to that...

One Day Hero

6-May-2013
10:07:34 PM

Kieran, if you really want to have a "what the hell is wrong with the young generation" moment, try exploring the meaning of the term "crushing some rigs" :D


ajfclark

7-May-2013
7:39:14 AM

On 6/05/2013 kieranl wrote:
>Not at all grumpy, just curious. Wonder how it started and why the need for a new term?

I've also heard them called alpine draws before.

maxdacat

7-May-2013
8:43:47 AM

i call 'em long draws....there is the possibility they can unclip themselves like this:

http://www.ukclimbing.com/videos/play.php?i=773

technogeekery

7-May-2013
8:56:56 AM

On 6/05/2013 kieranl wrote:
>> Wonder how it started and why the need for a new term?

Suspect it is a term coined by sport climbers. The earliest references to the term I've seen are from RC.com in 2004, sport climbers moving in to trad and asking about extending pro with "trad draws". I guess if you come from a sport climbing background, an open sling with two karabiners used that way appears very similar to a quickdraw.

I have mentally adopted the term for 30cm slings set up with 2 krabs, as opposed to slings (60cm or longer, which I carry doubled or tripled) or sewn quickdraws, its a useful distinction. But yeah, "short sling" has worked wel for a long time :-)

Decoy

7-May-2013
9:01:12 AM

On 7/05/2013 ajfclark wrote:
>I've also heard them called alpine draws before.

I think the definition of an alpine draw is: A trad draw where the gates have frozen shut.

Mike Bee

7-May-2013
9:12:15 AM

I call 'em long draws too, but I am familiar with trad draws as a term too.

Thats a well scary story. I hope they can come to some definitive conclusion, because I am very curious.

Wendy

7-May-2013
9:55:32 AM

put me in the old crew too - trad draw? I climb trad on about 4 different sorts of draws! I just call them all draws. If I wanted to specify sorts, I'd ask for an extendable draw (that's the double/tripled sling or one with a fixed biner (I have dog bones with and without rubber gadget to hold the biner) or an open draw, being basically a short sling not doubled up. I don't really have many of these any more, but I used to have heaps when I first started.

kieranl

7-May-2013
10:29:01 AM

On 7/05/2013 Mike Bee wrote:
>I call 'em long draws too, but I am familiar with trad draws as a term
>too.
>
>Thats a well scary story. I hope they can come to some definitive conclusion,
>because I am very curious.
Also very lucky not to have the rope cut through on one of the sharp edges of the broken biners.

gfdonc

7-May-2013
10:32:36 AM

The original quick-draw concept was a preclipped cling on the lead rope if I remember correctly .. what was his name now .. Bill Forrest?


dangerlaef

7-May-2013
11:50:59 AM

Yay, someone else remembers this etymology!

I remember seeing it illustrated, but cant find a picture in all the web.

There are 22 messages in this topic.