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Chockstone Forum - Find Climbers

Find Climbers In Your Area

 Page 3 of 3. Messages 1 to 20 | 21 to 40 | 41 to 50
Author
Help find Prabh Srawn $50,000 reward
Damo666
19/06/2013
12:52:15 PM
What a mess.

I don't agree with everything in that post, but I agree with this:
"My comment about irrationality is that it takes a special kind of crazy to think that flying from Canada to Australia to look for what is certainly a deceased person will make any bit of difference. The reward is also irrational since it contains an assumption that he might be alive.
While I think it is irresponsible and bordering on criminal to offer such a reward, I understand it as the cry of grief and desperation that it is."

Grieving families get a LOT of latitude by authorities and the media for their actions in these situations - much of it never reaches us in the public (ask a crime journo). This time some of it is leaking out to us, or being forced on us by the family, somewhat understandably.

When those involved are so openly, and it must be said ignorantly and ungraciously, critical of the search authorities then it makes those authorities even more wary and risk-averse and media shy and family-senstive next time this happens - which makes the situation even worse for those families who are damned to come after.

I was up there on the 26th, climbing at Blue Lake and camping up just over Twynam Saddle. TWO helos flew repeated flights over and near me on the 25th and 26th - nearly two weeks after the guy went missing. I was amazed that the authorities would continue to dedicate these resources to someone who was/is almost certainly dead. I would not ask that for me (not that I go off in jeans and cotton shirt with a bad forecast). Every minute in a helicopter is a risky minute of someone else's life.

Just after he went missing there was significant snowfall. It's only that these last two weeks (until yesterday) have seen much of that snow melt that there would be ANY chance of finding his body. Normally he would be buried until November, at best, and the futility of all this would be even more obvious.

There were almost no foot, ski or skidoo tracks in that Blue Lake / Twynam region so I figured most of the searching was being done by air. I'm not sure that is the best way, maybe so, but it didn't ring true with media stories of multiple foot searches. Maybe they were all over near Townsend, where he was allegedly supposed to be. I hope so. I'm always skeptical of the SAR stories that come out of the Snowies at these times as I was dismayed to hear so much misleading and inaccurate rubbish propagated by the police when those snowboarders went missing in 1999. 'Crevices', cornices, avalanches were all proffered by police spokespersons, repeated in the media, as possible causes of their deaths, which to people experienced in the area would be laughable if the situation was not so tragic.

This kind of misinformation, and the repeated falsehoods of the victims being 'experienced' etc when they really clearly aren't, seeps into the public consciousness and gives a false impression of the real dangers down there and fails to educate the broader public about them - and the cycle continues once more.
Damo666
19/06/2013
12:52:37 PM
On my way back from Blue Lake to CP on the 26th I encountered two pairs of tourists who both asked about the feasibility of following the 'track to Kosciuszko summit'. They were looking at the foot-marked start of the long circular track that crosses the Snowy, goes up and over Carruthers, past Townsend, Mueller etc, to Kozi then turns back to traverse the old road to CP. That is 18km and would take most of them at least four hours *in normal summer conditions*. At the car park on the 25th yet other visitors were contemplating it around 2pm, until I told them definitely do NOT even try it. I should add that at that time the police skidoo trailer was there, empty, so they were out there somewhere.

What they did not realise was that the 'track' petered out into snow up over the hill about 15min past the river. Ideally they would find this out soon enough and safely enough, but that track does lure people a bit further out than is good for lots of them. I like that these people are getting out and seeing Australia and are not afraid, or too lazy, to walk away from their cars (the number of huge SUVs I see go up to CP turn around and just turn around and drive away is amazing - they don't even stop and get out). I also hate further regulation of us and our wild areas by 'authorities' and I don't want more signs in the bush. But this is one unique spot and case where I think maybe a sign or two about the real hazards and some (heavily legalese-ified no doubt) advice would be beneficial.

Not that this may be relevant here - I hope not - but if we are going to discuss these things we should keep in mind what a good friend and homicide detective once told me. As soon as these things happen the police check hire car companies and others in the area. People often stage, or try to stage, a disappearance and stash a hire car somewhere (Geehi in this case?) and drive off into a new life, leaving behind whatever financial, legal or family troubles bedevilled their old life. Bank records and other personal details are scrutinised for any evidence of this. All this stuff goes on behind the scenes that we don't see on tv but affects the actions of those left behind to face the consequences of whatever happened. Please note I am not even remotely suggesting this is the situation for this man, but it is an issue in all these cases.
Damo666
19/06/2013
1:20:59 PM
This was one of the two helos searching at 0915 on the 26th. You can see the snow cover on Mt Twynam. Most of this fell after the man went missing.



The terrain lower than this, down to the river level, was patchy with lots of rock and bush showing and it would have been extremely difficult for anyone anywhere to spot a person or body in such a visually complex field.
FatCanyoner
19/06/2013
1:52:43 PM
And the family are continuing to slag the authorities publicly. I'm really not sure how they think this will help Prabh...

http://www.abc.net.au/local/stories/2013/06/18/3784375.htm

From his sister:

"I have an issue with the people calling the shots and searching in certain areas that doesn't make sense to me and calling off the search so early. They told us on the 14th day that he wouldn't have been able to survive for 14 days so they were going to scale back and call off the search which I think is absolutely ridiculous.
"They started searching the sixth day my brother had gone missing because that's when they found out and to call off the search after searching for a week... it's almost disgusting, it's inhumane that you have no compassion for human life that's out there," she said.
"I really think things need to change around here."

Duang Daunk
19/06/2013
2:49:40 PM
>From his sister:
>
>"I have an issue with the people calling the shots and searching in certain
>areas that doesn't make sense to me and calling off the search so early.
>They told us on the 14th day that he wouldn't have been able to survive
>for 14 days so they were going to scale back and call off the search which
>I think is absolutely ridiculous.
>"They started searching the sixth day my brother had gone missing because
>that's when they found out and to call off the search after searching for
>a week... it's almost disgusting, it's inhumane that you have no compassion
>for human life that's out there," she said.
>"I really think things need to change around here."

He is gone, sister.
You can bury the remains if they are found after the winter thaw.
If I find them then (obviously a much better time to search), are you still gonna pay me a hundred grand to salve your grief?

Damo666. You should send that pic to sister along with the date it was taken and your comments, as she obviously doesnt have a sense of reality for the situation.
technogeekery
20/06/2013
8:46:43 AM
That picture of the helo above the snow tells the whole story, really. Just looking at that makes a needle in a haystack look like good odds.
lacto
20/06/2013
9:22:51 AM
didn't simon crean brother disappear in known area near there and remained missing for many years despite much post thaw searching. much later somebody found the corpse and removed portions and belongs without telling anyone .

wallwombat
21/06/2013
2:56:09 AM
FatCanyoner is a journo/canyoner/food critic/climber/gay bar loiterer.

I'm a bit of a fan.

Don't hold that against him

FatCanyoner
21/06/2013
7:30:14 AM
I take offence at that!

I'm an EX-journo. The rest all sounds correct, although I would probably have included nude bushwalker myself...

IdratherbeclimbingM9
Online Now
21/06/2013
8:54:52 AM
On 21/06/2013 wallwombat wrote:
>FatCanyoner is a journo/canyoner/food critic/climber/gay bar loiterer.
>
> I'm a bit of a fan.
>
>Don't hold that against him

On 21/06/2013 FatCanyoner wrote:
>I take offence at that!
>
>I'm an EX-journo. The rest all sounds correct, although I would probably
>have included nude bushwalker myself...

~> You have not been on a Nangar epic with wallwombat and widewetandslippery! Such action is tantamount to taking your life in your hands with the scrub and ants out that way, though the climbing is good...
;-)

 Page 3 of 3. Messages 1 to 20 | 21 to 40 | 41 to 50
There are 50 messages in this topic.

 

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