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Crag & Route Beta

Area	Location	Sub Location	Crag	Links
All NSW	(General)	(General)	(General)

Author

Warrumbungles


wallwombat

31-Mar-2010
10:08:09 AM

Use a hand drill.

Auspep

31-Mar-2010
10:12:21 AM

Whats the difference if you can bothered climbing up with an electric + battery + bolts?


IdratherbeclimbingM9

31-Mar-2010
10:34:05 AM

On 31/03/2010 Auspep wrote:
>If you climb straight out the top of Caucusus Corner there is a line of
>hangers (prob 7 or 8) that go through the overhung choss at the top!

Does anyone know any further detail on this line? FA party, date, name of line, etc?
I also wonder if the loose volkswagon size block is still perched in the top of that corner?


wallwombat

31-Mar-2010
11:00:30 AM

On 31/03/2010 Auspep wrote:
>Whats the difference if you can bothered climbing up with an electric + battery + bolts?

You're right. There's no difference. Grid bolt the phuking place.

That's not my real answer but I can't be bothered writing a bloody essay on historical precedents, the National Parks attitude towards bolting, maintaining the character of climbing areas and people who can't tell the bloody difference.

Auspep

31-Mar-2010
11:09:36 AM

I'm all for maintaining character, I'm pretty sure I wrote that in my previous thread. Not talking about gridbolting at all, just replacing existing bolts, but don't you think if there were cordless hammer drills in the 60's they would have used them?


wallwombat

31-Mar-2010
11:31:35 AM

On 31/03/2010 Auspep wrote:
>Whats the difference if you can bothered climbing up with an electric +
>battery + bolts?

About 5kg

Auspep

31-Mar-2010
11:36:14 AM

Take less gear!


nmonteith

31-Mar-2010
11:42:21 AM

You guys crack me up.


wallwombat

31-Mar-2010
11:53:04 AM

I'm going up for a few days in October. I'll take a drill and some bolts up and replace some anchors. I've been meaning to do Ginsberg, so I'll try and sort some of the anchors out on that.

Neil, I'm glad I crack you up.

Why don't you take some bolts up and replace some anchors too. You like bolting. Expansion bolts will be fine up there.

Apologies Auspep. I've decided I don't care if people use a hand drill, a power drill, a petrol drill or a Boeing 747.

But mark my words, start the ball rolling and Bundy will be up there in a flash bolting every crack in site.


wallwombat

31-Mar-2010
12:36:38 PM

I think I have a problem. I really do.

I have a Bosch. I have bolted sport climbs. I have placed anchors. I'm no saint.

Then someone mentions taking a power drill to places like The Warrumbungles and I lose all rationality. I forget that I have a power drill myself and I become some rabid antibolting crusader. I become John Bachar, only minus the climbing ability and the saxophone. I say things that I end up regretting. I piss people off. I make enemies.

Then I charge up the Bosch and go bolting and glue in dirty big ring bolts.

I'm a hypocrite. I realise that.

I need to seek professional help. I really do.


evanbb

31-Mar-2010
12:45:30 PM

On 31/03/2010 wallwombat wrote:
>I need to seek professional help. I really do.

Well, I'm not arguing with this, but maybe not a Doctor, just an English teacher or something. The main problem seems to be that someone mentions replacing anchors and using a power drill to speed the process and you think this means bolting the whole Bungles. There is grey in between.

I don't buy the slippery argument either, which seems to worry you. The same 'logic' has been applied to Ben Lomond, that bolted anchors will give a Green Light to bolting lunatics and then we're off to the races. I don't think that's the case at all. Using Piddo as my example, which the Bungles have some parallels with, there are loads of bolted anchors above trad routes, and some trad routes that could probably use a sneaky bolt here and there. And they've been like that for years, with no indication that Flake Crack is about to be bolted because 'who has a #3 Camalot these days anyway'.

I think your fears are coming from a sane perspective, but reality seems to show they are unfounded.

Auspep

31-Mar-2010
12:47:26 PM

Hahahaha GOLD!

Trust me when you start up that pitch off the bolted belay on Ginsburg looking 10m down your rope to the single bent carrot belay, no gear between you and it, the stories of 25m falls in the guidebook whirling around in your head, you will wish you had a couple of nice glue in ring bolts for a belay.


wallwombat

31-Mar-2010
1:00:47 PM

On 31/03/2010 Auspep wrote:
>Hahahaha GOLD!
>
>Trust me when you start up that pitch off the bolted belay on Ginsburg
>looking 10m down your rope to the single bent carrot belay, no gear between
>you and it, the stories of 25m falls in the guidebook whirling around in
>your head, you will wish you had a couple of nice glue in ring bolts for
>a belay.

The rock up there is hard enough to take mechanical bolts, which, unlike glue-ins , can be placed on lead.

egosan

31-Mar-2010
1:02:56 PM

On 31/03/2010 Auspep wrote:
>Trust me when you start up that pitch off the bolted belay on Ginsburg
>looking 10m down your rope to the single bent carrot belay, no gear between
>you and it, the stories of 25m falls in the guidebook whirling around in
>your head, you will wish you had a couple of nice glue in ring bolts for
>a belay.

No, I don't trust you. There is room in this world for people who like stories of 25m falls on single carrot belays running around in their heads. The assumption that everyone ticks along thinking as you might is fraught with problems.

I have with great reluctance started to admit other people exist. Maybe you should too.

widewetandslippery

31-Mar-2010
1:03:14 PM

On 31/03/2010 wallwombat wrote:

>
>The rock up there is hard enough to take mechanical bolts, which, unlike
>glue-ins , can be placed on lead.

With a power drill...


IdratherbeclimbingM9

31-Mar-2010
1:21:29 PM

On 31/03/2010 egosan wrote:
>There is room in this world for people who like stories of 25m falls on single carrot belays running around in their heads.

& ww wrote
>I lose all rationality. I forget that I have a power drill myself and I become some rabid antibolting crusader.

It is good to have/be(?) both.
Without peer pressure the climbing fraternity would have no self moderation. The climbing game continues to evolve and Australia is blessed with enough diversity of climbers, and rock, that for the foreseeable future we are in the happy position of being able to mostly accomodate all points of view.

evanbb wrote
>I don't buy the slippery argument

I do. I have been around long enough and seen too many contoversial actions not to believe that slope exists. Without peer pressure (sometimes irrational?), it only takes a few flies in the ointment to turn it bad...

jrc

31-Mar-2010
1:26:31 PM

Neither Ginsburg nor Elijah need any new bolts. Those that are there can be backed up safely by cams, wires and other carried protection. Same with the 'scary' belay at the start of the traverse pitch on FotP. That can be made bombproof with a few sensibly placed wires. There is excellent gear on these routes; the possible exception being the runout crux (second last) pitch of Elijah.
However you don't go to the Bungles for a Shipley experience.


IdratherbeclimbingM9

31-Mar-2010
1:28:09 PM

Well said jrc.


wallwombat

31-Mar-2010
1:29:35 PM

Evan, I have no problem with bolted anchors. Anchors are usually placed on belay stances and when you are on a stance it isn't very hard to use a hand drill. Sure it is more of a hassle than using a rotary hammer but it's a trade off - lugging a rotary hammer drill up a multipitch route in The Warrumbungles would seriously suck.


rodw

31-Mar-2010
1:34:08 PM

Lugging a power drill anywhere sucks..I think the walk in and nature of most of the routes at the Bungles will ensure it'll keeps its adventure ethics...Id doubt anything said here will change that.

There are 111 messages in this topic.