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General Climbing Discussion

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Personal Trainer

Duncan

15-Feb-2011
12:54:22 PM

Wait, heavy stuff falls faster than light stuff now?


gordoste

15-Feb-2011
1:14:03 PM

On 15/02/2011 Duncan wrote:
>Wait, heavy stuff falls faster than light stuff now?

No but imagine you have two people of similar height, one of whom weighs 100kg and the other weighs 70kg. The force due to air resistance is pretty much the same as their surface area is very similar, however the resultant deceleration will be significantly greater (about 43% greater assuming the same force) for the lighter guy and he won't be able to stay close enough to film.


ambyeok

15-Feb-2011
3:13:38 PM

Anyone ever stuck a paper clip on the front of their paper aeroplane? Same concept right?

Edit: Oh, hang on, I was thinking wing suits... as you were...


jezza

15-Feb-2011
5:18:29 PM

Gravity - what you need is tighter, more slippery clothes, and a pointier head. At least you're on the right forum!

Gravity

15-Feb-2011
9:07:37 PM

On 15/02/2011 gordoste wrote:
>On 15/02/2011 Duncan wrote:
>>Wait, heavy stuff falls faster than light stuff now?
>
>No but imagine you have two people of similar height, one of whom weighs
>100kg and the other weighs 70kg. The force due to air resistance is pretty
>much the same as their surface area is very similar, however the resultant
>deceleration will be significantly greater (about 43% greater assuming
>the same force) for the lighter guy and he won't be able to stay close
>enough to film.

Spot on.
>

Gravity

15-Feb-2011
9:12:55 PM

On 15/02/2011 Wingello Panther wrote:
>On 15/02/2011 gordoste wrote:
>>On 15/02/2011 Duncan wrote:
>>>Wait, heavy stuff falls faster than light stuff now?
>>
>>No but imagine you have two people of similar height, one of whom weighs
>>100kg and the other weighs 70kg. The force due to air resistance is pretty
>>much the same as their surface area is very similar, however the resultant
>>deceleration will be significantly greater (about 43% greater assuming
>>the same force) for the lighter guy and he won't be able to stay close
>>enough to film.
>>
>
>
>
>I dont reckon the force% matters a damn in a deceleration in the scene
>the thread started with.
>>I want to start camera flying (skydiving) but I have found that I am
>too light (67kg) and need to wear lead weights to keep up with others.
>
>instead itd be bloody messy by all accounts.
>
>I reckon he'd keep up once the chute opens if he used a smaller chute.

You are correct that a smaller chute increases glide angle due to a higher wing loading, thus allowing a smaller person to 'fall' faster. However, by the time the chutes are out, the show is over. After the freefall, jumpers are required to track away from others before deploying their chute. Flying under canopy in close proximity to others is extremely dangerous and not the work for a camera-flyer (unless it's for CRW). This is a whole other skill set (CRW) for advanced canopy pilots. So, the issue is fall rate during freefall, not under canopy.

Gravity

15-Feb-2011
9:31:08 PM

On 15/02/2011 Gravity wrote:
>On 15/02/2011 Wingello Panther wrote:
>>On 15/02/2011 gordoste wrote:
>>>On 15/02/2011 Duncan wrote:
>>>>Wait, heavy stuff falls faster than light stuff now?
>>>
>>>No but imagine you have two people of similar height, one of whom weighs
>>>100kg and the other weighs 70kg. The force due to air resistance is
>pretty
>>>much the same as their surface area is very similar, however the resultant
>>>deceleration will be significantly greater (about 43% greater assuming
>>>the same force) for the lighter guy and he won't be able to stay close
>>>enough to film.
>>>
>>
>>
>>
>>I dont reckon the force% matters a damn in a deceleration in the scene
>>the thread started with.
>>>I want to start camera flying (skydiving) but I have found that I am
>>too light (67kg) and need to wear lead weights to keep up with others.
>>
>>instead itd be bloody messy by all accounts.
>>
>>I reckon he'd keep up once the chute opens if he used a smaller chute.
>
>You are correct that a smaller chute increases glide angle due to a higher
>wing loading, thus allowing a smaller person to 'fall' faster. However,
>by the time the chutes are out, the show is over. After the freefall, jumpers
>are required to track away from others before deploying their chute. Flying
>under canopy in close proximity to others is extremely dangerous and not
>the work for a camera-flyer (unless it's for CRW). This is a whole other
>skill set (CRW) for advanced canopy pilots. So, the issue is fall rate
>during freefall, not under canopy.

Haha. Sorry wrong forum!


atreyudelacy

15-Feb-2011
10:59:10 PM

The extra muscle won't make you climb harder (well, it might help with a funky move here or there) But at the same time, i don't think it will adversely affect your climbing so long as you keep climbing while putting on the weight. (and stretch)

If climbing is your main physical activity, then i'd say use the gym time as an opportunity to work some opposing muscles - which will actually help reduce your risk of injury.

Unless you already have big legs - then that's probably the easiest spot to start with adding weight, despite what a lot of people might say, i don't think an extra 5kg in the legs will hurt too much. (especially on watchtower faces ;-) )

One Day HEro

16-Feb-2011
12:40:22 AM

On 15/02/2011 atreyudelacy wrote:
>Unless you already have big legs - then that's probably the easiest spot
>to start with adding weight, despite what a lot of people might say, i
>don't think an extra 5kg in the legs will hurt too much. (especially on
>watchtower faces ;-) )
>
Spot on! That's why old, fat has-beens like slabs so much. It's the style of climbing which is least debilitated by their extra flab. Steep, enduro stuff on the other hand......

If you are suffering from small man syndrome, go ahead and bulk up.....maybe you'll feel better about yourself. Trying to reconcile it with climbing is futile, better to find an excuse.....like the skydiving thing.

Downhill ski racers, speed skaters, track cyclists, rowers, swimmers, rugby players, baseball players?!........all seem to benefit from bulking up (or at least there isn't a negative effect)......all flat ground (or gravity powered) sports. As soon as precision or hills are involved, the anorexics take over. I don't like it any more than you do, but you gotta face facts.

16-Feb-2011
8:38:53 AM

On 14/02/2011 skip-skip wrote:
>Extra weight will not be definitely detrimental. See The Beast Within
>Training School for personal rock climbing training.

The Beefcake Within?!

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