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N008ie mistakes???

DrDan

23-Oct-2008
3:05:17 PM

G'day guys,

I'm relatively new to climbing, but love it in every way - discovered it through friends at a gym, but I really want to get away from indoor climbing (plenty of show offs & posers at the gym, and you just get grosed out by sleezy blokes that just oggle chicks all day long. Plus, whats the fascination with seeing/doing the same thing again and again and again... [besides training, that is...]).

My questions is...
I've started purchasing gear here and there, and am seeking the experience and knowledge of people that have started off similarly - ie, a noob, getting gear.
Allow me to learn through some of your mistakes.

What should I get and hat should I avoid?
What should I look out for?
What are the vital things to look out for with basic gear?

Eg- I've noticed the cheaper quickdraws are freakin hard to clip rope in to... (ok, so call me a baby...). Etc.
I take it I should avoid buying second hand gear on eBay, such as cams/wires, etc? Or is the climbing community relatively safe in this regard...?

I have harnesses, shoes, a few carabiners and quickdraws, 60m dynamic climbing rope, 15m static, 7 step etier/aide, prusik ropes (x5), slings, chalk, finger tape.

Also, I was wondering if anyone abseils/descends on dynamic rope? Is this necessarily bad for dynamic rope?
I ask because I was thinking of anchoring at the top, descending and climbing back up solo with a prussik as a self belay - is this a bad idea? Do I just need to find some climbing friends that actually want to do stuff outdoors...?

Any advice would be greatly welcomed! :D

Cheers,

Dan.

noclimberboys

23-Oct-2008
3:20:15 PM

Gosh, you have a hotpoch of gear there DrDan.

What are you doing with etts?

Def. meet up with people and if youre a cool person, someone will take you out ; ) Sydney has a lot of strong climber chicks.

Using prusik knots on solo climbing?? May be hard to feed through during the crux moves, man.

Hear you on the guys oggling girls things... surprisingly I overheard some girls doing the same at some gym... they were there to check out guys rather than climb! Can you believe that!!

> Plus, whats the fascination with seeing/doing the same thing again and again and again.

Haha... that's really just what happens outside... only you've got flies to contend with

Personally, I'm concerned for you... your questions indicate you're new to climbing (newer than me!that's not a dig at you rather just a dig at me). But you're looking into solo stuff... which is mega advanced terrain. Really focus on social skills and hang out with nice people who will show you stuff.

Ps dynamic rope is okay to absail off. Read up about top rope anchors.

glebechris

23-Oct-2008
3:58:03 PM

>My questions is...
>I've started purchasing gear here and there, and am seeking the experience
>and knowledge of people that have started off similarly - ie, a noob, getting
>gear.
>Allow me to learn through some of your mistakes.
>
>What should I get and hat should I avoid?
Typically people start with sports climbing gear. It's easier to get on a crag that way and then add in trad gear if they want. A starting point would be to get
4-6 screw gate carabiners
4-6 spring gate carabiners
8-10 quickdraws
10-12 bolt plates
Cordelette is useful
Rope
Harness
Belay device
Shoes
Chalk
A good training course or experienced companion

Later you can add in trad gear and there are plenty of forums on this website if you search.

>What should I look out for?
I personally wouldn't buy second hand ropes, slings, harness on ebay or other trading sites.
>What are the vital things to look out for with basic gear?
Start cheap. You can build up later if you have the money. For most beginners a rope is a rope and a quickdraw is a quickdraw (though if they feel crap don't buy them - move up a notch and spend a little more until you are happy.) Keylock/nose thingy quickdraws are good when you are starting - much easier to unclip when you have back clipped!
I'd look at getting 10.5mm rope - easier to handle and belay with, more durable, feels safer than something skinny.

>Eg- I've noticed the cheaper quickdraws are freakin hard to clip rope
>in to... (ok, so call me a baby...). Etc.
>I take it I should avoid buying second hand gear on eBay, such as cams/wires,
>etc? Or is the climbing community relatively safe in this regard...?

I've bought off eBay and never had a problem. If you stick to buying name brand metal gear (cams, carabiners, hexes, nuts etc) and check them when you get them for cracks, damage, scarring etc. Be particular circumspect about the slings on cams. Potentially replace any rope or webbing on hexes if it looks faded, rough, split or otherwise dodgy (rope and webbing can be weakened by UV, but also by other substances that don't present such obvious symptoms). But these are my opinions - it would be sensible to get someone to check anything out for you.
>I have harnesses, shoes, a few carabiners and quickdraws, 60m dynamic
>climbing rope, 15m static, 7 step etier/aide, prusik ropes (x5), slings,
>chalk, finger tape.
Not sure why the etrier is there - unless you are going straight into aiding....
>Also, I was wondering if anyone abseils/descends on dynamic rope? Is this
>necessarily bad for dynamic rope?
>I ask because I was thinking of anchoring at the top, descending and climbing
>back up solo with a prussik as a self belay - is this a bad idea? Do I
>just need to find some climbing friends that actually want to do stuff
>outdoors...?

Most guys will take one rope to a crag and climb/descend/abseil etc on that one dynamic rope. A static can be useful if you want to abseil in to a crag and climb out - it abseils better and can be left in place as an escape route - it is much easier to ascend a static in my experience than a dynamic. Abseiling on a spare static would preserve your dynamic rope, but you would carry in more gear - and you'd need to get a longer static than you currently have.

Roped solo climbing is a bit specialist and relatively high risk. Certainly wouldn't be doing that on a single prussic. Search these forums for "Solo Aiding a beginners intro". and then don't do it until you really understand your gear and rope work.
>
>Any advice would be greatly welcomed! :D

Do a course, or find an experienced partner and second up stuff. Then move on to the sharp end and build up your knowledge. Before you pile into anything - try reading some of the accident reports.
>
>Cheers,
>
>Dan.


shamus

23-Oct-2008
4:06:43 PM

With a harness, shoes, rope and belay device, you should be able to find leaders with their own rack who can do the leading for you in the outdoors. You'll learn more about climbing in general, especially if they go out of their way to coach you in technique and gear placement. Before buying the bulk of my rack, I was exposed to a few different leaders and their gear (and club stuff), got to know the good and the bad of different gear. By taking gear out and putting it in, you'll work out which feels best to you, everything from how you rack it to which cams / nuts / carabiners you like. Second-hand gear can be good. Personally would never buy ropes second-hand, wouldn't normally get slings but i trusted the seller, and i'd feel more confident buying off here than ebay. Its down to trusting the seller and the gear that'll save your life.

Abseiling on dynamics is standard procedure for getting down from many climbs. Top-rope self-belay / solo / whatever you want to call it is fine it you've got the equipment and knowledge to do it safely. I've only ever done it on less-than or vertical climbs, and you can use a mechanical prusik for that (eg a shunt, now watch the thread degenerate...) Look up the threads on that topic if you're interested. I'd recommend being very confident with anchors, the setup and rope-work in general prior to doing it by yourself.


Sabu

23-Oct-2008
4:10:53 PM

On 23/10/2008 DrDan wrote:
>What should I get and hat should I avoid?
>What should I look out for?
>What are the vital things to look out for with basic gear?
>I take it I should avoid buying second hand gear on eBay, such as cams/wires,
>etc? Or is the climbing community relatively safe in this regard...?
Probably best to avoid second hand as you don't know the history of the gear, but if
you're buying in bulk, buy online or even overseas for cheaper deals (depending on the
value of the dollar!)
For starting out: a set of wires is good, find a brand you like. then buy some hexes then
cams, mainly because hexes are easier to place when starting out and a lot cheaper,
but thats all personal preference.

>I have harnesses, shoes, a few carabiners and quickdraws, 60m dynamic
>climbing rope, 15m static, 7 step etier/aide, prusik ropes (x5), slings,
>chalk, finger tape.
Why the static? Won't need that unless you're setting up topropes and leave the chalk
& fingertape behind as you won't need them outside!

>Also, I was wondering if anyone abseils/descends on dynamic rope? Is this
>necessarily bad for dynamic rope?
it's what they're designed for! go for it.

>I ask because I was thinking of anchoring at the top, descending and climbing
>back up solo with a prussik as a self belay - is this a bad idea? Do I
>just need to find some climbing friends that actually want to do stuff
>outdoors...?
I take it you haven't got much experience outdoors, given that, my advice would be to
join up with a club and go on organised trips rather than rush out and try it by yourself
when you're not familiar with it. You can jump on a few learn to lead courses or just find
an experienced friend to take you and show you the ropes (forgive the cliche please!).
That way you can learn in a safer environment with plenty of people around to correct
you should you make a mistake.
Hope that helps!


Pat

23-Oct-2008
5:30:39 PM

At the risk of starting the whole helmet debate - if you go near any rock, get yourself a helmet. And wear
it. Oh yeah, you might want to get a belay device as well.


Cookie

23-Oct-2008
5:42:26 PM

On 23/10/2008 Pat wrote:
>At the risk of starting the whole helmet debate - if you go near any rock,
>get yourself a helmet. And wear
>it.

are helmets compulsory (like cycling helmets are on the road)?


evanbb

23-Oct-2008
5:53:18 PM

On 23/10/2008 Cookie wrote:

>are helmets compulsory (like cycling helmets are on the road)?

I was going to say yes, but only in the gym, but I'll leave it. ;)

Not compulsory at all. In any form of climbin; unless you're paying someone or in someone else's care. I highly recommend getting a good one, if it's comfortable you won't mind wearing it. The stats are pretty convincing as to their effect too; I think I read that there hasn't been a death of a climber in Australia that was wearing a helmet in 40 years or so. But they're more important in some areas than others. Somewhere like Centennial in the Bluey's, which is a steep sports crag, it's probably not necessary because there's no one on the cliff above you and little chance of hitting your head on something if you fall.

At trad crags like Piddington, or Araps I put my helmet on as I get out of the car. Bumblies get in to the strangest places and the chance of having a hex dropped on your head is high.


Sabu

23-Oct-2008
9:50:28 PM

On 23/10/2008 Cookie wrote:
>On 23/10/2008 Pat wrote:
>>At the risk of starting the whole helmet debate - if you go near any
>rock,
>>get yourself a helmet. And wear
>>it.
>
>are helmets compulsory (like cycling helmets are on the road)?
No but start the habit of wearing one early on, it will be easier that way.

Olbert

23-Oct-2008
11:07:54 PM

Firstly I would agree with a few other people and say dont go out alone till you are very confident and experienced. Try and find people to go with-making friends at the bouldering wall at the gym really isnt that hard.

Secondly whether you start with trad gear or sport gear really depends on where you are, if you are in Victoria then the old and crusty climbers there have managed to stop any routes under 20 or so (with a few exceptions) being bolted and so you might have to get some trad gear. If you are in NSW there are plenty of easier sport routes at different crags and so a trad rack is not necessary.

Remember there is a big difference between reading a pamphlet that comes with a set of hexes/nuts/cams and placing them. IMO nobody should place natural gear on a route without previously learning how to place it from an experienced person/guide AND getting them to tell you what you are doing wrong and what you could do better etc.

widewetandslippery

24-Oct-2008
10:51:21 AM

First thing to remember is equipment is generally a subsitute for your owm inadequacy. I own a lot of equipment.

Read some books and some googling and you will find some most fantastic things have been climbed with less stuff than you have. That said in interest of your self preservation buy good shit.

Obtuse equipment is for people who know exactly what they want. BD or Wild Country cams and nuts, good biners. Soft wear is different. As a beginner you will root your first rope fast, cheap or expensive. It will highly likely be your fault. That'll learn you. Then buy a good one. I actually believe buying cheapo extenders and slings off the reel are the way to go. It encoureges you to replace them when they should be rather that when they fall apart.

Helmets are for people who care.


Eduardo Slabofvic

24-Oct-2008
12:25:42 PM

On 23/10/2008 Cookie wrote:
>are helmets compulsory (like cycling helmets are on the road)?

Nothing is compulsory, you decide what it is your going to do and how your going to do it and then you
accept the consequences of the decisions you've made.


Capt_mulch

24-Oct-2008
12:38:16 PM

>are helmets compulsory (like cycling helmets are on the road)?
Seeing as you only have one head, a helmet is a great idea. I personally wear one as much as possible as smashing your head in is like having a car crash - you've only got to have a bad one once and you're f^*&ed. Read some of the accident register stories for how many people could still be climbing if they'd only been wearing a helmet.

Duncan

24-Oct-2008
3:21:09 PM

On 23/10/2008 evanbb wrote:
>At trad crags like Piddington, or Araps I put my helmet on as I get out
>of the car. Bumblies get in to the strangest places and the chance of having
>a hex dropped on your head is high.

I spent a few nights in hospital a few years back after some Euro asshat kicked some rocks off the top of Piddo. It was a glancing blow, but could easily have killed me if it had hit direct. My helmet was sitting a metre away (we'd just arrived).


evanbb

24-Oct-2008
3:31:29 PM

On 24/10/2008 Duncan wrote:
> some Euro asshat

Did you pick up asshat from First Dog? He's the funniest cartoonist on the net. I would have also accepted assclown.

Duncan

24-Oct-2008
3:52:49 PM

No. Achewood is the funniest cartoon on the interwebs.

I have no idea where I picked up asshat.


pmonks

24-Oct-2008
4:10:04 PM

> What should I get and hat should I avoid?

I think a must on every beginner's rack is a full set of hexes - nothing says "shit hot climber" like strutting into a sport crag, clanking like the tin man!

And if you're going to get some, make sure the larger sizes are each strung with 6 feet of 11mm static cord, and the smaller ones are those pesky.....err....wonderful wired ones. I have a set just like that going cheap - 12 years old and barely used!

Cheers,
Peter

rolsen1

24-Oct-2008
4:23:05 PM

On 23/10/2008 evanbb wrote:
>At trad crags like Piddington, or Araps I put my helmet on as I get out
>of the car. Bumblies get in to the strangest places and the chance of having
>a hex dropped on your head is high.

If you only go to the popular crags and you know what you're doing then you don't need one...

but wear helmet if you want to, don't if you don't - but please don't preach about it here.

Duncan

24-Oct-2008
4:25:55 PM

On 24/10/2008 rolsen1 wrote:
>If you only go to the popular crags and you know what you're doing then
>you don't need one...

Wrong.

rolsen1

24-Oct-2008
4:27:45 PM

why?

no you're wrong!

(btw I wish there was a way to block you helmet wearers)

There are 60 messages in this topic.