Chockstone Forum

      Sponsored By
      ROCK
   HARDWARE

Chockstone Photography

Australian Landscape Prints

Chockstone Forum - General Discussion

General Climbing Discussion

Author

What's missing from the new Arapiles Guide?


Sabu

22-Sep-2008
11:41:13 PM

On 22/09/2008 richardo wrote:
> I still believe Spain is the best crag with the best country.
Guess i'm going to have to repeat simey's point cos the last time i looked Spain WAS a
country, you are still yet to name an actual crag.

On 22/09/2008 wallwombat wrote:
>Sport climbers, who can't place gear, will be a bit limited there but
>they suck anyway , so that doesn't matter a whole lot. And they have Blackheath,
>anyway. And climbing gyms. And Nowra.

Funny you mention that cos the one who started this argument has ticks limited to the
following boxes: Gym, Sport, Boulder. nuf said!

simey

23-Sep-2008
8:16:37 AM

On 22/09/2008 richardo wrote:
>On 22/09/2008 simey wrote:
>>On 22/09/2008 richardo wrote:
>>>I accept your retraction.
>>
>>What do you mean by retraction? Everything you have said has been stupid
>>nonsense and I still believe Arapiles is the best crag with the best camping.
>
>And best wheelchair access for geriatrics? Keep the self selecting criterion
>coming. I still believe Spain is the best crag with the best country.

I would have thought that 'where to stay', 'ease of access' and 'climate' were fairly relevant when it comes to discussing the merits of crags around the world. There are a lot of great climbing areas that suffer signifcantly in these areas.

As for the sport climbing/trad climbing argument... I reckon you can ignore whether the routes are trad or bolted and simply focus on the quality of the climbs. Even if all the routes at Arapiles were bolted, they would still be considered exceptional quality.


Rich

23-Sep-2008
8:55:26 AM

Presles better than Araps?? Pull the other one. There's not even a campsite! Atho we did find a pretty sweet vacant block of land. Also has a great town nearby with a river (essential in summer!). Some nice multipitch routes but of course nearly all Europe is sport not bomber trad like Araps. If you're after sport, sure Europe is awesome.

I spent 10 months in 06 climbing around Europe and personally thought the best crag was Verdon but I still thought after it all was said and done that you couldn't beat Araps. Short walk-in access, bomber gear, climbable almost all year round, variety, bomber gear, available partners, cheap camping, long-term camping, cheap(ish) food not too far away and of course bomber gear.

Only downside is that it's not closer to Melbourne (sorry Radelaidians!).

Wendy

23-Sep-2008
9:13:18 AM

On 22/09/2008 spicelab wrote:

>
>Believe it or not, this view was formed after climbing all over Europe
>and realising just how unremarkable 98% of their crags are.
>
>While I totally agree that the place itself has never benn more accurately
>described than (by Chris Baxter I think) as 'an environmental black hole',
>I still think, considering the key attributeis of a SINGLE crag, Thompson's
>Point is the second most diverse crag I've climbed at in the world.

I will agree that for a single crag, in fact it's even all the one cliff, it's not bad. And quite varied in terms of route angles. But still, all sport, maybe a couple of 2 pitch routes, one manky 14 as the easiest route, 1 crack, actually, that was trad ... busy, speedboat infested, shit infested, and my sociology text book was stolen from my car there the week before my exams ...

When we start discussing the second best crag, I can see this could go on for a while, but merely in terms of places I would consider before Thompson's Point (in no particular order with no great amount of forethought):

Yosemite
Stapylton (even if you divide it up into the bits accessed from Hollow Mountain and the bits accessed from Mt Zero to crawl into single crag status, both bits are great)
Moonarie
Piddington (esp if you consider the conituation of the cliff in both directions, being Pindari and ZigZag)
Montserrat (it even has it's own Natimuk)
God forbid, I'd look twice at Ceuse and the Verdon and I really don't like either off them.
I notice the Indian Creek guide book touts itself as the best crag in the world too.
The gunks
Pra nang
Rosea
I reckon there's probably a few others in that crag called Spain, but like a lot of famous French crags, Finale and Wales, many are areas more than single crags. Anything in Britain has to be written off for the weather anyway. Corsica has some awesome areas as well. The whole area thing is a different story though.

But I wouldn't look at the Val di Mello. Despite be proclaimed as the Yosemite of Europe, it was very dissapointing for everything but looking pretty and having lots of bouldering.


Eduardo Slabofvic

23-Sep-2008
10:22:27 AM

I thought Verdon was a great crag, but camping was about 7km away from the crag, so doesn't make my list for that reason.

I was trying to identify great climbing areas, where camping/food/non-climbing activities are close at hand, so there are many great climbing areas that fall short on one thing or another.

So there are a few places that are good climbing areas, that don't make my list. Yosemite is not on my list because of the whole valley floor situation. I found it to be repulsive.

Joshua Tree is still one of my favorite places (despite it being granite), but there's not much else to do other than climb, chase rattle snakes, and ride Winnebagos. So it's not on my list, even though I would gladly go there again.

Fontainebleau doesn’t make my list because it's not a climbing area.

I'm going to continue to stick up for Presele, as I found it to be great.

I will also take this opportunity to add Montserrat to my list of great crags that have cheap camping, good climbing and a few other things to do when not climbing

..and of course there are a whole lot of great crags that I haven't been to, so can't comment on them.

....anyway, I only had to mention 1


tnd

23-Sep-2008
11:16:24 AM

On 22/09/2008 wallwombat wrote:
>...That is why people
>travel from other countries to climb there...

And thank fcuk for that, it keeps them away from the decent crags in the Blueies.

james

23-Sep-2008
1:00:33 PM

On 22/09/2008 Wendy wrote:
> but I already see a problem - limestone. Not that
>I dislike climbing on limestone, it makes for great climbing for perhaps
>the 1st 5 years after it's development as a crag. Climbing ruins limestone.
>Polished rock is terribly unpleasant. Any limestone crag that sees as much
>traffic as Arapiles would rapidly have as much friction as your toilet
>bowl.

Take off your rose coloured glasses! SO many Arapilies 'classics' are polished just like limestone. sure polished climbs suck, but lots of Arapilies is as polished & chalked as your average limestone clip-up.

widewetandslippery

23-Sep-2008
1:19:03 PM

On 19/09/2008 shiltz wrote:

>
>But what's missing? Has anyone pored through and noticed major omissions
>or surprise inclusions?
>Feel free to rant away even if it is your own route that got left out,
>it was a route that you never got around to writting up, or it only got
>a first ascent after the publication date.

Free beer vouchers

simey

23-Sep-2008
1:30:06 PM

On 23/09/2008 james wrote:
>On 22/09/2008 Wendy wrote:
>> but I already see a problem - limestone. Not that
>>I dislike climbing on limestone, it makes for great climbing for perhaps
>>the 1st 5 years after it's development as a crag. Climbing ruins limestone.
>>Polished rock is terribly unpleasant. Any limestone crag that sees as
>much
>>traffic as Arapiles would rapidly have as much friction as your toilet
>>bowl.
>
>Take off your rose coloured glasses! SO many Arapilies 'classics' are
>polished just like limestone. sure polished climbs suck, but lots of Arapilies
>is as polished & chalked as your average limestone clip-up.

Actually that is bullshit. Arapiles routes don't become more polished with traffic as is the case with limestone. At Arapiles the rock is either slick to begin with, or it retains its frictional properties remarkably well. In over twenty years of climbing there I don't think any of the popular routes feel any more polished than from when I first did them.

james

23-Sep-2008
2:02:53 PM

polished...slick.. whatever.... at the end of the day its the same whatever you want to call it. Some like a bit more friction & a bit less polish/slickness/slipperyness

PS: I still think Araps is the best all round crag I've been to in all my years of climbing.


Sabu

23-Sep-2008
2:14:16 PM

On 23/09/2008 simey wrote:
>Actually that is bullshit. Arapiles routes don't become more polished
>with traffic as is the case with limestone. At Arapiles the rock is either
>slick to begin with, or it retains its frictional properties remarkably
>well. In over twenty years of climbing there I don't think any of the popular
>routes feel any more polished than from when I first did them.

What about the start of watchtower crack? its pretty freaking slick there.

simey

23-Sep-2008
2:50:55 PM

What I am saying is that the rock hasn't been made any more slick by climbers. I'm sure the first climbers that launched up Watchtower Crack (well to be more precise Salamander as that was done first and shares the same start) thought the initial moves were slick too. However the rock on most other sections of Watchtower Crack isn't that slick, except the start of the last pitch.


Capt_mulch

23-Sep-2008
3:20:24 PM

>What about the start of watchtower crack? its pretty freaking slick there.
Did it on Sunday wet (Bomber Pro leading - heading for Skink), no problems. Maybe the grip improves with the rain! Anyway, Leleana Mulch loves the new guide, it's the best she's seen so far!

gfdonc

23-Sep-2008
3:20:34 PM

Golden Streak. It says so in your guide. ;-)

Seriously, though - if you've never climbed on polished limestone there's no comparison to the glassier bits at Araps. That stuff is seriously slick.


MrsM10iswhereitsat.

23-Sep-2008
4:03:54 PM

On 23/09/2008 Capt_mulch wrote:
>Leleana Mulch loves the new guide, it's the best she's seen so far!
>
>

>
Dear dear me Mr Capt-mulch!
You really must read mildredmademiserable's posts before you expose your lovely young daughter to the guiles of "he who wrote the book".
Much as I admire your exposing her to climbing at a young age, I fear that you must take a wholistic view of the situation!

Wendy

23-Sep-2008
4:05:56 PM

On 23/09/2008 gfdonc wrote:
>Golden Streak. It says so in your guide. ;-)
>
>Seriously, though - if you've never climbed on polished limestone there's
>no comparison to the glassier bits at Araps. That stuff is seriously slick.
>

Have to agree on both points ... polished limestone is the pits. Try smearing on your toilet bowl, it will be similar.

People have been climbing at Araps for 50 years, there's really no polish going on compared to old limestone crags. Take Introductory Route. First thing done here. Not a hint of glassiness anywhere. The Eighth. About the 2nd one. Fantastic friction.

Some routes do suffer a little from something that's sort of like chalk and sweat caking - usually in places that don't see the rain, like under the roof on Tanin, the start of Second Coming, Golden Slime, the overhangs of d minor.

Arapiles is quartzite. That can be just naturally glassy, and there are plenty of smears that feel a little dicey just because of that, particularly low on the cliff, where they were all smoothed off by the sea once upon a time.

hero

23-Sep-2008
11:44:43 PM

All this bull shit.

What's missing frm the arapiles guide?

Poetry, style, integrity...


stevec

24-Sep-2008
5:01:26 AM

The Wolgan is the best crag in the world.
Ticks all the boxes. easy routes, hard routes, no sport routes, best campsite in the world complete with bogans!
Plus it is about 10 hours easier to access than Arapalump. Probably better quality rock too!


evanbb

24-Sep-2008
11:36:49 AM

On 24/09/2008 stevec wrote:
>The Wolgan is the best crag in the world.
>Ticks all the boxes. easy routes, hard routes, no sport routes, best campsite
>in the world complete with bogans!
>Plus it is about 10 hours easier to access than Arapalump. Probably better
>quality rock too!

I can't believe that you logged in from England to post this!

The Wolgan would definitely be the best in the world when that pub was still serving tap beer. With some luck the new licensing laws will see the return of frosty cold ones to the Valley.


IdratherbeclimbingM9

24-Sep-2008
12:30:51 PM

On 24/09/2008 evanbb wrote:
>The Wolgan would definitely be the best in the world when that pub was
>still serving tap beer. With some luck the new licensing laws will see
>the return of frosty cold ones to the Valley.

There was a time (around 1974/5 if I recall correctly), when the Newnes Pub not only served cold beer, but also had a regular Wednesday night 'chinese meal' as well. Locals from miles around and irregulars like myself would happily partake of both the rich food, and the excellent hospitality.
Floods that year also heavily damaged some of their buildings as well as the road leading into Newnes.

There are 125 messages in this topic.