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Chockstone Forum - General Discussion

General Climbing Discussion

 Page 1 of 2. Messages 1 to 20 | 21 to 21
Author
Learn To Lead

vcc
4/09/2008
8:02:11 PM
For those who want to Learn To Lead, well look no further we have started up our Learn to Lead course's again

Dates for the Course are
SPRING 2008 DATES
October Saturday 11th & Sunday 12th
October Saturday 18th & Sunday 19th
October Saturday 26th and Sunday 27th

OR
Or for the week of
Sep 27th to Oct 2nd

More details can be found on or web site:
http://www.vicclimb.org.au/Site/index.php
or you can contact me

Cameron Abraham
VCC Trip Coordinator
clubtrips@vicclimb.org.au
Victorian Climbing Club Incorporated
GPO Box 1725, MELBOURNE VIC 300

Eduardo Slabofvic
5/09/2008
7:58:15 AM
Do you have a Learn to Hang Dog course?

BoulderBaby
5/09/2008
8:57:58 AM
Yeah, I'd love to learn to lead.. Except I can't afford it.

ado_m
5/09/2008
9:12:09 AM
Cam - who is taking the course?
fish boy
5/09/2008
9:50:45 AM
Learn to fall?

MrsM10iswhereitsat.
5/09/2008
10:04:12 AM
On 5/09/2008 ado_m wrote:
>Cam - who is taking the course?
The participants silly billy. Maybe you mean who will be the instructor? Perhaps it is the lovely Mr Cameron Abraham as mentioned in the post for being VCC Trip Coordinator?

On 5/09/2008 Musique wrote:
>Yeah, I'd love to learn to lead.. Except I can't afford it.
I think you will find that joining the VCC is cheaper than paying for a course and has ongoing benefits as well, like "learning to lead", that I have seen no mention of having to pay for.


BoulderBaby
5/09/2008
10:44:33 AM
It says its only availible to VCC members, and its $600 to do the course.. thats what I've read from the flyer.
Still, way out of my budget.


http://www.vicclimb.org.au/Site/includes/file.php?id=204

vcc
5/09/2008
10:49:00 AM
On 5/09/2008 ado_m wrote:
>Cam - who is taking the course?

Ramon Francis- South West Adventures

MrsM10iswhereitsat.
5/09/2008
10:50:47 AM
Miss Musique wrote;
>flyer
I did not know this. Thank you for updating my education my dear, and I agree it does sound expensive. Perhaps you can try the old fashioned way and link up with a mentor or group (like the VCC), to learn from over a longer period of time?

vcc
5/09/2008
11:04:10 AM
The Learn to Lead course has been organized by the VCC so that members, or those wanting to join and enjoy the benefits, have the opportunity to learn some solid skills in leading in a concentrated shorter period of time for a reasonable price. Past courses have always been popular and the VCC makes no profit from this arrangement.
As...

On 5/09/2008 MrsM10iswhereitsat. wrote:
> Perhaps you can try the old fashioned
>way and link up with a mentor or group (like the VCC), to learn from over
>a longer period of time?

While the VCC does not 'officially' teach, there are always very experienced members on all trips who are more than happy to guide you in a range of skills. For those who can't take up the option of the Learn to Lead course (which is well worth it!), and who have patience and time, maybe the old fashioned way is the best option for them.



Pat
5/09/2008
1:10:45 PM
While it may be out of reach for some, 600 for three weekends seems pretty good value.

NZclimber
5/09/2008
1:29:46 PM
Trad or sport?

IdratherbeclimbingM9
5/09/2008
1:44:37 PM
On 5/09/2008 NZclimber wrote:
>Trad or sport?

I'd suggest that if there was a choice, the participants would get a great deal better value for their money learning to lead trad than sport! In fact I am surprised that you could even equate them in one sentence/thought! Heh, heh, heh.

Maybe more info can be found here; ~> being a link to the mob referenced above.

BTW; I have nil affiliation with the above mentioned (blah, blah, etc) ...

ado_m
5/09/2008
2:51:28 PM
$600 is fantastic value for 3 weekends of instruction. I'm surprised that even covers the PI! Good on you for organizing the thing Cam, I have some mates who are starting out on the glorious caper that climbing is, and will suggest this to them (reduces the chance they will kill me one day).


cruze
5/09/2008
3:27:06 PM
$600 per person
4 people per instructor
$2400 per instructor for 6 days

$400 per day per instructor minus expenses.

Not bad.

Pat
5/09/2008
6:52:01 PM
On 5/09/2008 cruze wrote:
>$600 per person
>4 people per instructor
>$2400 per instructor for 6 days
>
>$400 per day per instructor minus expenses. (such as fuel, insurance, superannuation, wear and tear on
the gear, - seems fair enough - do commercial operators have to pay a permit fee?)
>
>Not bad.
stuart h
7/09/2008
10:39:29 PM
In answer to Patís question as to whether commercial operators had to pay to operate on public land (and not making any comments on the value of this program).

In so far as I understand it, to operate on public land such as National Parks commercial organisations such as a company or individual guides, are required to be licensed by or hold a concession from the land managers (typically Parks Vic/DSE here and DOC in NZ).

Getting these licenses generally requires an application and/or processing fee up front and then payment of a set fee for each participant day. While they add to the overheads in what is generally a fairly low margin industry, these costs are probably not especially onerous.

Probably the larger cost arises from the Parks Vic requirement that the operator hold a $10M public liability insurance policy on which PV are named as an interested party as a pre-requisite for the issuing of a license to operate.

Insurance works out to be very expensive in terms of % of turnover as most are fairly small operations in a niche industry and therefore donít enjoy benefits of scale individually or across the industry, in contrast to other professions. Negotiating a collective insurance and access concession, such as that organised by the Association of Canadian Mountain Guides, would probably be a good goal for the ACIA if they wanted to grow the guiding and instruction industry in Australia.

muki
8/09/2008
9:33:42 AM
Sounds great in theory, but we are not allowed to get offshore insurance anymore.

Pat
8/09/2008
10:44:58 AM
On 7/09/2008 stuart h wrote:

>Probably the larger cost arises from the Parks Vic requirement that the
>operator hold a $10M public liability insurance policy on which PV are
>named as an interested party as a pre-requisite for the issuing of a license
>to operate.
>
>Insurance works out to be very expensive in terms of % of turnover as
>most are fairly small operations in a niche industry and therefore donít
>enjoy benefits of scale individually or across the industry, in contrast
>to other professions.

Slightly off topic, but don't I know it. I owned a backpackers hostel, and we were basically a small
family operation that chose to close because the insurance went from 4k one year to 20k. Too deeper
cuts into profit. I needed public liability to do any advertising with the state tourism board. they
wouldn't even look at us until we supplied a copy of our certificate of insurance.

Back on topic - the learn to lead course still seems OK value if you want to use a course to get going.

vcc
2/10/2008
7:43:29 PM
Another shameless BUMP,things are warming up. Time to get outdoors.

 Page 1 of 2. Messages 1 to 20 | 21 to 21
There are 21 messages in this topic.

 

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