Chockstone Forum

      Sponsored By
      ROCK
   HARDWARE

FREIGHT FREE
in Australia

Black Diamond: SET of 6 "C4" Cams and 6 matching wire Gates. Camelots sizes .4, .5, .75, 1, 2 & 3 and Nuetrino 6 Pack. SUPER Special!!! $435.00
20% Off

Australian Landscape Prints

Chockstone Forum - General Discussion

General Climbing Discussion

Author

More slackline anchors

Cliff

27/03/2013
9:29:34 AM

On 26/03/2013 kieranl wrote:
>Lowest force on the anchors and maximum force on the body will be if they
>fall just as they start out. That's also when they can easily hit stuff
>if the cliff below is under vertical.

and its where most falls happen... esp w newbies


JimmyS

27/03/2013
10:00:39 AM

Not sure if this has been posted already, but 'the digger' seems to be a 'famous' arapiles highline*.

*according to this highly, over produced video: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G9e7y9R8lXo

kieranl

27/03/2013
10:10:02 AM

It's actually a trilogy (digger, cobber, mate) forming a triangle of highlines. Good concept really, and no point me sniggering at the naff names with my record.

leopotamus

7/04/2013
7:58:57 PM

Let it be said that Prohibition in this context never works, especially with adventurous types like climbers and highliners.

is anyone talking to the highliners about this?

I believe high lining is still young and new. So you are getting your a rag tag group of dudes and dudettes taking ever opportunity to explore their passion, just like the climbing community was decades ago right?

There must be some association or group that is responsible for monitoring/tracking all the routes that are currently bolted in araps. Wouldn't it be smarter and safer to work with highliners and getting good infrastructure setup and maintained.... and perhaps more importantly getting that information publicized? Just like climbers have established central resources.

I think this will ensure the responsible installation of infrastructure, minimise impact on the rock, and maximise safety for everyone.

Does anyone know of an initiative going on like this?

dan_b

7/04/2013
9:02:04 PM

Saw a hand written note on the Pines toilet noticeboard today about "Slacklining Australia" or somesuch, based out of QLD. Maybe someone there could have a look?


Sabu

7/04/2013
10:10:07 PM

The video that won the judges vote at Goastfest was effectively a reply form the slackliners about their bolting practices and the sport in general and alluded to this thread. The final line was something like "We feel the bolting was absolutely necessary".

So in one sense the message regarding climbers concerns is reaching at least some individuals in that community which means there is possibility of dialogue occurring. Did anyone get a chance to speak to Sam (I believe that was his name) or other members of that group?


ajfclark

8/04/2013
7:48:54 AM

I think it was "We feel the bolting was necessary but we're happy to speak to people about rigging, preferably in person". I did speak to Sam, but only about his video submission.

Paul

8/04/2013
8:20:10 AM

Wendy

8/04/2013
11:05:08 AM

On 7/04/2013 Sabu wrote:
>The video that won the judges vote at Goastfest was effectively a reply
>form the slackliners about their bolting practices and the sport in general
>and alluded to this thread. The final line was something like "We feel
>the bolting was absolutely necessary".
>
>So in one sense the message regarding climbers concerns is reaching at
>least some individuals in that community which means there is possibility
>of dialogue occurring. Did anyone get a chance to speak to Sam (I believe
>that was his name) or other members of that group?

I have his phone number (if I haven't lost it in the choas that is my car at the moment) but haven't had the time to call him yet. I thought it was nice that he did something to initiate discussion, but I still disagree that the anchors were necessary - all three of those points have massive chunks of rock you can rap the rope around if nothing else.And the video shows them rigging a force of what someone suggested could be up to 12 kn off two bolts attached to a boulder already leaning over the cliff edge slightly, in the direction it is already leaning. I must admit, i'd be way more concerned about that then any decently rigged removable anchor. Actually, I'd be concerned about the rope swing as well. I figure the centre point can be fixed as it's a tight line, so they are going for a swing on a biner (or somesuch thing) free to slide along the line? Does this leave enough control as to where you might end up at the end of that swing? I mean, I'd hate them to leap off and suddenly slide sideways and smash into one of the cliffs on either side of it. That'd be ugly.


sliamese

8/04/2013
1:58:40 PM

im keen to catch up with these guys when im there shortly to help set it up and play on it! i think have dedicated bolts, easier safer and just plain better! It seems a weak argument that climbers can have the thousands of bolts at araps, but highliners cant have a few dozen? Climbers can justify the chains on ali's but not these ones?!

My only suggestion would be have independant anchors, probably at least M16 stainless glu-in threads to take an eye-nut, as smaller bolts will have their Working Load Limits exceeded i reckon.

Araps stone must be about 2.4 tonne/m3, so that block would weigh more than enough. But agree the sideways loads a bit scary!

As for the rope swing, very easy to tie back the middle point in both directions so it cant leave the centre. Most of this stuff is pretty basic rigging really.

Wendy

8/04/2013
2:48:04 PM

On 8/04/2013 sliamese wrote:
>im keen to catch up with these guys when im there shortly to help set it
>up and play on it! i think have dedicated bolts, easier safer and just
>plain better! It seems a weak argument that climbers can have the thousands
>of bolts at araps, but highliners cant have a few dozen? Climbers can justify
>the chains on ali's but not these ones?!

I disagree with the chains on Ali's as well, which you could probably find on a thread or two on here somewhere!

The problem kind of stems from the ongoing lack of agreement as to what are approriate bolts or not and how to minimise their impact. When a safe trad anchor is available, and access to and from the area is safe and not causing damage, I don't think we need them. And I'm pretty mellow on the whole anchor front, I'm not a Macca about it!. I agree with a whole bunch of them around Araps. These anchors just fall in the "I don't think we need them catagory" (of which I can list a bunch of climber placed anchors as well, and a little search will find I've said all that before here too) - for example, if the people are happy with those two bolts in the boulder, why not just sling the whole boulder or and equivalent one? What's the difference? Choke the boulder or otherwise anchor it so it can't ride up, (I'd probably give it a back up somewhere cause I'm into having more than one anchor, but they were happy with just the boulder) and off you go.
>
>Araps stone must be about 2.4 tonne/m3, so that block would weigh more
>than enough. But agree the sideways loads a bit scary!
>
>As for the rope swing, very easy to tie back the middle point in both
>directions so it cant leave the centre. Most of this stuff is pretty basic
>rigging really.

Well, I hope they did, cause I had horrifying visions of it all going wrong!

Trent Williams

12/04/2013
10:06:48 AM

Hi All, I've been a climber for the last 15 years and over the last year been involved a lot in highlining. I've established new highlines and done a bit of lining at Araps. I'm happy to talk to anyone about highlining issues. I've even got a load cell so can share some real world values of longline tensions and highline forces. Just send me an email. I will be down at Araps over the beginning of May, so will be happy to meet anyone there.

In Brisbane the climbers and highliners generally have a good relationship. The slacklining community in Brissy is alive and thriving and is very much pro-active in consulting with climbers (most highliners happen to be climbers anyway). It would be great if something like this could happen in Victoria.

In my experience highliners have as much an appreciation of nature as climbers do. I can't speak for everyone, but in my experience highliners do take seriously the issue of bolt placements and don't spray them willy nilly. Believe it or not there is an ethic to prefer natural anchors over bolts.

I believe the best way forward is to ensure everyone makes an attempt to get good information before going off the handle and to hold back on threats of chopping slacklines! Destroying other peoples property is not an acceptable solution to this issue and could be very dangerous to those concerned. Those of you who have made comments about this may be joking, but others reading this may take your words seriously and think that this is an acceptable form of behavior. Just think about it from your perspective of someone taking a knife to your safety equipment.

I will be catching up with Sam over the next week so will be able to get more info then. As I said before I'm happy to talk to anyone. Just send me an email at post@trent.net and we could go from there.

Happy climbing and slacklining!

Trent

access t

12/04/2013
10:17:14 AM

Nicely said Trent!

One Day Hero

12/04/2013
12:37:56 PM

On 12/04/2013 Trent Williams wrote:
>I can't speak for everyone, but in my experience highliners
>do take seriously the issue of bolt placements and don't spray them willy
>nilly. Believe it or not there is an ethic to prefer natural anchors over
>bolts.
>
Yeah, so clearly that wasn't the case at Araps seeing as the dudes sprayed a bunch of bolts around (rather willy and a little bit nilly). Any chance you could talk to those guys and see what the deal is, then adjust the above statement so that it meshes with reality? Cheers

>I've even got a load cell so can share some real world values of
>longline tensions and highline forces.

Also, I have a little pissing match going on with Shortman, and we're too lazy to research things for ourselves. Is there any chance that you could tell us the highest load cell reading you've ever gotten from a person on (or off) a slackline? Thanks

There are 114 messages in this topic.