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Chockstone Forum - General Discussion

General Climbing Discussion

 Page 8 of 9. Messages 1 to 20 | 21 to 40 | 41 to 60 | 61 to 80 | 81 to 100 | 101 to 120 | 121 to 140 | 141 to 160 | 161 to 168
Author
Shooting In National Parks - NSW
lacto
23/02/2013
8:58:22 AM
Professional hunters in victoria for foxes ??? the skins are near worthless and the government currently pays a $10 bounty and dont think anyone has had more than 1000 scalps so what a great professional grossing $10,000 pa nett probably $0 .

Majority of foxes are shot very locally

IdratherbeclimbingM9
Online Now
24/02/2013
3:25:24 PM
On 23/02/2013 lacto wrote:
>the government currently pays a $10 bounty

Didn't they recently increase that, to match the NSW bounty?

wallwombat
24/02/2013
10:22:45 PM
My question is, can we shoot back?
technogeekery
25/02/2013
8:44:18 AM
wallwombats are a protected species

Garrath
25/02/2013
5:19:23 PM

>Majority of foxes are shot very locally

Professional or not, hunters still hold off during mating season.

kuu
25/02/2013
5:50:42 PM
ABC Online News is reporting the following . . .

" Leaked documents show New South Wales park rangers will have to wear high-visibility clothing to ensure they do not accidentally get shot when hunting commences in National Parks."

http://www.abc.net.au/news/2013-02-25/fluoro-vests-to-protect-rangers-from-hunters/4538330

No mention of park users but I suppose they should adopt the same approach?

lacto
26/02/2013
8:18:14 AM
On 25/02/2013 Garrath wrote:
>
>
>Professional or not, hunters still hold off during mating season.

I think you would find it would be the ambition of every livestock producer to get rid of foxes at all times , particularly the breeding time as the need of food to feed young leads to greater demand for food . One of the worst sights is finding a cow with a calf head projecting the calfs tongue is chewed off Very large percentages of lambs fall to predation. Alpacas and guard dogs dont kill foxes but send them elsewhere , though a neighbour assures me emus actully persue and if they can kill foxes .He took the stock from a broke emu farmer and they are very prolific on his place but he doesn,t exploit them and they are spreading around the area .
>
technogeekery
26/02/2013
9:03:21 AM
On 25/02/2013 kuu wrote:
>ABC Online News is reporting the following . . .
>
>" Leaked documents show New South Wales park rangers will have to wear
>high-visibility clothing to ensure they do not accidentally get shot when
>hunting commences in National Parks."
>
>http://www.abc.net.au/news/2013-02-25/fluoro-vests-to-protect-rangers-from-hunters/453833
>

This actually strikes me as being one of the best ways to block this flawed policy. I believe that most rangers are completely opposed to this proposal, and as government workers literally in the firing line, they could probably protest it on the basis that providing fluoro vests (Pwersonal Protective Equipment) is inadequate and the risk of getting shot is completely avoidable by banning shooting in their workplace.

From Workcover NSW:

"Employers obligations to personal protective equipment

You must provide personal protective equipment (PPE) to workers and visitors as a control measure when work hazards are unable to be eliminated or adequately controlled by other methods. PPE can be used as an interim control measure whilst employers develop and implement more effective control measures, wherever possible.


Clause 15 of the Occupational Health and Safety Regulation 2001 states that the employer must:
determine if PPE is the most appropriate control, based on risk assessment
•ensure that the equipment provided is appropriate for the person and controls the risk for that person"


[my bold]

If I was in their place, I'd be arguing strongly that the risk of being shot could easily be controlled/eliminated by not changing the regulations, and that provision of PPE is inadequate in controlling the risk.

The risk to park users is small (but very serious in consequence) - but the risk to rangers who are in the field regularly is considerably higher. If a ranger were to be shot, their managers and directors would be personally liable, under NSW Workplace legislation.

billk
26/02/2013
12:29:00 PM
On 26/02/2013 technogeekery wrote:
>The risk to park users is small (but very serious in consequence) - but
>the risk to rangers who are in the field regularly is considerably higher.
>If a ranger were to be shot, their managers and directors would be personally
>liable, under NSW Workplace legislation.

Responsibility should go further up the chain of command. Barry O'Farrel should guarantee that he will resign if any ranger or any park user is shot.

davidn
26/02/2013
12:44:37 PM
On 26/02/2013 billk wrote:
>Responsibility should go further up the chain of command. Barry O'Farrel
>should guarantee that he will resign if any ranger or any park user is
>shot.

Nice rhetoric...

Anyhow, sorry if this has been covered but what are the stats on people getting shot by hunting parties in the US? (not people pulling a Cheney but actually shooting someone outside of their hunting party)

Eduardo Slabofvic
26/02/2013
12:56:02 PM
On 26/02/2013 ratherbeclimbinv9 wrote:
>Nice rhetoric...
>
>Anyhow, sorry if this has been covered but what are the stats on people
>getting shot by hunting parties in the US? (not people pulling a Cheney
>but actually shooting someone outside of their hunting party)


Do you count kids going to school with their assult rifles a "hunting party" or is that some other kind of party?
james
26/02/2013
1:07:13 PM
>Anyhow, sorry if this has been covered but what are the stats on people
>getting shot by hunting parties in the US? (not people pulling a Cheney
>but actually shooting someone outside of their hunting party)

Can't give you stat's but I remember hearing of 3 (?) deaths in Alberta Canada last fall. People die every year from accidental hunting shootings. If you think people won't die if hunting is allowed in Parks then you really need to pull your head out of your arse.

The only good thing that will come from this is if hunters accidentally shoot each other.
technogeekery
26/02/2013
1:29:48 PM
On 26/02/2013 billk wrote:
>Responsibility should go further up the chain of command. Barry O'Farrel
>should guarantee that he will resign if any ranger or any park user is
>shot.

I don't know how far up it DOES go in public service. In the business world, it is all the way up to the directors of the company, who are legally responsible for deaths / injuries in their companies.

To my point on the parks people - this from the SMH an hour ago:

The Public Service Association of NSW on Tuesday morning called on the government to release maps of all proposed Zone C hunting areas.

“If the state government proceeds with its flawed plan to allow hunting by amateurs, then the Public Service Association of NSW will consider directing its members not to enter any national park with a 'Zone C' area as their safety cannot be guaranteed," said PSA General Secretary, Anne Gardiner.

“The Government's own department responsible for initiating this flawed plan is already warning of the high risk of serious injury or death and the Premier and Minister need to sit up and take notice.”


Read more: http://www.smh.com.au/nsw/ofarrell-shoots-down-bid-by-hunters-to-use-silencers-20130226-2f2qx.html#ixzz2Ly5bmbys

davidn
26/02/2013
3:50:07 PM
On 26/02/2013 james wrote:
>Can't give you stat's but I remember hearing of 3 (?) deaths in Alberta
>Canada last fall. People die every year from accidental hunting shootings.
> If you think people won't die if hunting is allowed in Parks then you
>really need to pull your head out of your arse.
>
>The only good thing that will come from this is if hunters accidentally
>shoot each other.

Yes, so, in the vein of my last reply, love the bombast, but i'd love some real stats. Don't get me wrong, I don't want to be shot in the head like pretty much anyone who's **ever existed**, but... Inferring that actually asking for stats means I think people won't die if hunting is allowed in "Parks" is a bit over the top don't you think? Any by that, I mean very over the top, praps a leedle bit like the people you hatin on!

;)
james
26/02/2013
4:04:43 PM
On 26/02/2013 ratherbeclimbinv9 wrote:
>Yes, so, in the vein of my last reply, love the bombast, but i'd love
>some real stats. Don't get me wrong, I don't want to be shot in the head
>like pretty much anyone who's **ever existed**, but... Inferring that actually
>asking for stats means I think people won't die if hunting is allowed in
>"Parks" is a bit over the top don't you think? Any by that, I mean very
>over the top, praps a leedle bit like the people you hatin on!
>
>;)


http://www.dailyheraldtribune.com/2012/10/17/trio-of-hunting-accidents-in-western-canada-concerning

The third hunting misfire in Western Canada in less than two weeks has left a 56-year-old Delta B.C. man in a local hospital with serious, but non-life threatening injuries.

Police said the man was accidentally shot in the knee by a hunter from a separate party early Tuesday morning near Fort St. John in the Pink Mountain Recreational Area.

RCMP said he was sitting on an ATV in an area with poor visibility around 8:30 a.m. when a male hunter from Vancouver Island mistook him for wildlife and fired at him.

The wounded man was immediately given first aid then taken to Fort St. John Hospital before being transferred to the Queen Elizabeth II Hospital in Grande Prairie.

Tuesday’s accidental shooting comes on the heels of two fatal hunting incidents on Oct. 5.

A young woman was shot and killed about 80 kilometres south of Grande Prairie while out hunting with family members around 5:25 p.m.

The woman was airlifted to the QEII where she later died from her injuries.

Also on Oct. 5, a father-son hunting trip ended tragically when the 63-year-old man from Prince Alberta, Sask. mistakenly shot and killed his 36-year-old son.

The two men had been hunting about 280 kilometres east of Saskatoon.

“It just shocks me that this year there’s been three incidents in a very short time during hunting season,” said Kevin O’Toole, past vice-president of Wapiti Shooter Club, of the hunting season that runs from October to January.



james
26/02/2013
4:12:33 PM
I don't actually have a problem if people are hunting for good reason, but the reasons given for allowing hunting in NSW parks don't make sense though.
EVERY other country that allows hunting experiences deaths due to hunting.
If the NSW wants to break a very long history of no hunting in Parks then they should acknowledge that accidents will result...

Even the friendly kiwis across the ditch accidently shoot each other when targeting deer:
http://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=10832537
technogeekery
26/02/2013
4:20:43 PM
Stats from the USA are difficult, as reporting is state-based, and there is little good information about the USA as a whole. Best I could find is the Hunter Incident Clearinghouse reports http://ihea-usa.org/news-and-events/news/incident-reports?id=147 which attempt to collate stats from all the USA states & Canada. They have published reports from 2002-2007.

Quick summary of that is between 25 & 77 people killed in the USA in hunting accidents in each of those years, and 242-688 shot but not killed. Note that many states do not report hunting accidents, so this information is incomplete, and understates the real total. Detail from the 2007 report (220 non-fatal and 19 fatal hunting accidents) show the major reasons for the accidents to be:

(50) Shooter swinging on game
(32) Failure to identify target
(29) Careless handling of firearm
(29) Victim out of sight of shooter
(15) Victim moved into line of fire
(13) Failure to check beyond target

Hope that helps.

I think fluoro vests might not be the answer...
bobic
27/02/2013
2:52:23 PM
In a dicussion on the radio the other day they mentioned that in the10 years hunting has been allowed in NZ parks 10 people have been shot : 8 of those were hunters and 2 were park users.

IdratherbeclimbingM9
Online Now
27/02/2013
3:10:00 PM
I nearly got run over by a hoon in a 4wd driving around a campsite area, while I was sleeping in a designated camping area in a NSW NP once. I was in a bivvy bag adjacent the vehicle I obtained a lift in, due it being full of the owners at the time...
It was only good luck on my part that they missed me, as I am sure they didn't see me.
Perhaps we should call for a ban on hoons too.

Similarly, I had a new climbing rope chewed through by feral bilbies that I left at the base of a climb overnight once (to save lugging it back the next day), in a NSW NP.
~> We should ban feral bilbies too!
~> ... either that, or paint a target on their fleuro vests!
;-)
technogeekery
27/02/2013
5:59:05 PM
On 27/02/2013 IdratherbeclimbingM9 wrote:
>I had a new climbing rope chewed through by feral bilbies that
>I left at the base of a climb overnight once

Don't leave your feral bilbies at the base of a climb overnight!

 Page 8 of 9. Messages 1 to 20 | 21 to 40 | 41 to 60 | 61 to 80 | 81 to 100 | 101 to 120 | 121 to 140 | 141 to 160 | 161 to 168
There are 168 messages in this topic.

 

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