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Boltplates resulting in back-clipping when turned?

martym

23/10/2012
10:55:25 PM

So my wife insists I ask the Chockstone brainstrust:
On the weekend, she clipped a boltplate - biner facing straight out from the wall as they do from a hanging boltplate; then clipped the rope on the left side - away from her. Subsequently after climbing the 3m to the next bolt, she had crossed the bolt, and the rope had swung the quickdraw around = creating a back-clipped scenario.

At home we tried it a few times, and decided, yep - it seems like boltplates will rotate with the draw so that you end up backclipped.

Before slinging abuse - please grab a boltplate, pencil & quickdraw & try it out before this thread turns the usual way.

Mike Bee

23/10/2012
11:09:28 PM

It might end up back clipped, but I'd suggest that with the extra degree of freedom that the system would have because of the movement of the bolt plate, the chance of the back clip resulting in the rope seperating from the biner is even less of a likelihood than in a normal back clip situation.

It wouldn't stress me too much.

rightarmbad

23/10/2012
11:36:27 PM

I have never seen or heard of a back clipped draw come undone.
I worry more about fairies slitting my through while I am asleep.

I have seen though, a draw come off of a ring through rotation.

martym

24/10/2012
8:53:07 AM

On 23/10/2012 rightarmbad wrote:
>I have never seen or heard of a back clipped draw come undone.
>I worry more about fairies slitting my through while I am asleep.
>
>I have seen though, a draw come off of a ring through rotation.

Thanks for the reply - how did the draw come off the ring? Was it jammed in a certain way?

ajfclark

24/10/2012
9:33:59 AM

Rotates parallel to the face and the top bar of the ring opens the gate. I'll see if I can find a picture... I'm sure I've found one previously.

[edit: Had to dig these out of the way back machine because the original site has changed:

Previous discussion here: http://www.chockstone.org/Forum/Forum.asp?Action=Display&ForumID=5&MessageID=4058&Replies=1

I can imagine if you get this kind of rotation and gate opening with a hooknose biner, if the draw didn't fall off it might end up nosehooked too:
http://www.blackdiamondequipment.com/en-us/journal/climb//qc-lab-weakness-of-nosehooked-carabiners ]

Pat

25/10/2012
9:08:10 AM

Not sure what your actual question is Martym, but there was a previous discussion on this. When I read it I was sceptical, so I got all my different draws out and tried them on my keyhole brackets, and I could easily unclip every draw by rotating it very lightly as in ajfclark's pics.

It was quite an eye opener.

However, its never happened on the rock to me. I think that a combination of being aware of which direction you are going to climb after you pass the bolt, using a longer floppy trad draw, rather than using a more rigid sport draw and making sure the belayer always gives a good soft belay will mitigate most of the risk.

You could always eliminate it with a screw gate and keep your down climbing skills honed, - two things I never do.

martym

25/10/2012
9:24:22 AM

On 25/10/2012 Pat wrote:
>Not sure what your actual question is Martym, but there was a previous
>discussion on this.

Hi Pat - I did have a fish around in the search, but couldn't find anything specifically related to back-clipping - though that's been sufficiently answered above (for my wife at least!)
Question was: because the bolt plate moves so much, it can allow the draw to swivel into a back-clipped position, ie. rope running across the gate of the draw.
Response: not to worry, it'll move back into place.

When I read it I was sceptical, so I got all my different
>draws out and tried them on my keyhole brackets, and I could easily unclip
>every draw by rotating it very lightly as in ajfclark's pics.
>
>It was quite an eye opener.
Yeah, wondering what my wife will make of that.

>You could always eliminate it with a screw gate and keep your down climbing
>skills honed, - two things I never do.
If half my screw gates didn't keep mysteriously disappearing onto other's harnesses, i would try that. hohum.

There are 7 messages in this topic.