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BD Freewire using 2 wire gates on sport climbs?

ianpeterscott

26-Jan-2011
10:21:49 PM

I just got myself some Freewires and wanted to know about the risks of using these on bolt plates.
I have heard 2 things, obviously both opposite:
1. It's all good, you'll be fine.
2. No Way. Do not use a wire gate on a bolt plate because the bolt plate can come off.

I have (briefly) tested this, and yes, (with a lot of effort on the particular bolt plate) it came off. It was a fight to get it off, but with a different carrot it may come off easier.

Now, as we know, there are about 1000 different inherent dangers of climbing, is this just one to add to the list?
Because the chance of a crab turning and placing the wire gate over the bolt plate coupled with the force somehow being exerted upwards to let the bolt plate come off seems unlikely.

Thanks.

IdratherbeclimbingM9

26-Jan-2011
10:31:33 PM

A troll post?

There are many posts dealing with the dangers of using wiregates on bolt plates...
Rope drag will lift the bolt clipped krab, and possibly detach it (and hangar), from the bolt.

~> I wouldn't do it (clip bolt plates with wire gates), myself if I could avoid it.
☺

nmonteith

26-Jan-2011
10:53:06 PM

Do not use wire gate caribiners with removable bolt plates. There have been several accidents and near accidents from mixing these two. They will fall off - especially if the carrot bolt head is small.

ianpeterscott

2-Feb-2011
7:23:04 PM

Sorry, I don't really get how my post was troll.
But either way I couldn't find much info regarding the dangers, but thank you for your help.
After speakin to a few more mates i have invested in replacement crabs.

thanks

ajfclark

2-Feb-2011
8:46:27 PM

You can't have looked very hard. A quick google search for bolt plates wire gates pulls up this thread and the second hit is Climbers of WA:

1. Wire-gate carabiners, ultra-lightweight carabiners and bolt plates: never use a wire-gate carabiner to clip a bolt plate. The gates are so thin that that the bolt plate may come off the bolt even though the carabiner is still clipped through it. Since many routes in WA have hangerless bolts, it is best that on your rack you have wire-gate carabiners on the rope end of the draw only. You will only save 15 grams per carabiner so on 13 draws it is 200 extra grams, which is less than the weight of a cup of water - not worth risking your health over. For the same reason it is recommended not to use ultra-lightweight carabiners on the bolt plate end - they may be so thin in some sections as to give the same problem as a wire gate. Use a normal straight gate biner, no need for anything extra chunky, just make sure that it is not too thin.
PFH bolt plates have instructions cable tied to them that indicate the same.

mikllaw

3-Feb-2011
8:35:27 AM

And this from about a week ago
http://www.chockstone.org/Forum/Forum.asp?Action=DisplayTopic&ForumID=6&MessageID=16658&Replies=26&PagePos=20&Sort=LastMessage#newpost

It sounds like you need to cultivate a bit of fear
Or maybe not

maxdacat

3-Feb-2011
3:13:04 PM

Can you really have carrots on a sports climb?

rightarmbad

3-Feb-2011
3:46:39 PM

I wonder if a rethink on plate design could be a good thing?
What about if the track was made with a z bend in it that the bolt had to navigate to lift off?

A small slightly bigger circle for the bolt to rest in when it is fully placed, might encourage it to stay corralled in place.

I'm sure that a properly designed plate with a specified bolt could be made to work.
Then we still have a low profile solution for when it is required to be used.

sbm

3-Feb-2011
4:35:30 PM

On 3/02/2011 rightarmbad wrote:
>I wonder if a rethink on plate design could be a good thing?
>What about if the track was made with a z bend in it that the bolt had
>to navigate to lift off?
>
>A small slightly bigger circle for the bolt to rest in when it is fully
>placed, might encourage it to stay corralled in place.
>
>I'm sure that a properly designed plate with a specified bolt could be
>made to work.
>Then we still have a low profile solution for when it is required to be
>used.

Kong bolt plate with wire gate.

nmonteith

3-Feb-2011
4:47:36 PM

On 3/02/2011 sbm wrote:

>Kong
>bolt plate with wire gate.

They look good - but at $15 each?!.... lucky Mikl has retroed many of his 50m carrot pitches in the Bluies.

mikllaw

3-Feb-2011
5:08:16 PM

On 3/02/2011 rightarmbad wrote:
>I wonder if a rethink on plate design could be a good thing?
>I'm sure that a properly designed plate with a specified bolt could be
>made to work.
>Then we still have a low profile solution for when it is required to be
>used.

Yes, use a fat biner, preferably a screwgate

There are 11 messages in this topic.