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"Flat spots"

climber72

3-Dec-2009
4:47:37 PM

Do "flat spots" in dynamic rope compromise it's strength or longevity??

The reason I ask - after recently purchasing a new rope it has developed flat spots along 10 meters after lowering from the chains at Wave Wall in the Grampians.

It was the ropes first use and we only did three routes of around 10 - 15 meters.
Neither of us fell on the rope so I can assume the chains are the cause.

The rope is the first I have purchased from this very reputable maker, no rope I have previously owned (Mammut & Edelrid) has ever developed flat spots like this.

My main concern here (apart from spending close on AU $500) is the safety of the people who will be climbing on the rope in the future.

Any similar experiences, thoughts or recommendations?

I have already emailed the maker directly but received no reply for over two weeks!!

nmonteith

3-Dec-2009
4:50:00 PM

On 3/12/2009 climber72 wrote:
>My main concern here (apart from spending close on AU $500) is the safety
>of the people who will be climbing on the rope in the future.

Holy crap. $500 on a rope? Is that possible??

To answer your question, I only retire (or chop) my rope when the core start showing through the outer sheath. Flat bits seem to be ok, but they do wear faster.

climber72

3-Dec-2009
4:58:14 PM

On 3/12/2009 nmonteith wrote:
>>Holy crap. $500 on a rope? Is that possible??

Well at the time Neil $479 seemed like a reasonable price, after all it looks like a nice rope and I had the cash.

Given it will "wear faster', maybe not so attractive now tho!

rodw

3-Dec-2009
5:24:38 PM

>I have already emailed the maker directly but received no reply for over
>two weeks!!

probably on extend holidays after selling all those over priced ropes.

The good Dr

3-Dec-2009
5:38:22 PM

The kern (core) of the rope consists of multiple braided lines. It is a combination of the elasticity of the nylon, the 'looseness' of the core and the braiding (twisting) of the core strands that provides elasticity. Where the flat spots are often indicates some sort of damage that has not allowed the core strands to 're-twist' to their original state. Neil notes that they wear faster in these locations. This is due to the reduces elasticity of the rope in these locations and their tendency to flatten out on a loaded surface. Personally I either shorten or retire ropes with flat spots in them.

climber72

3-Dec-2009
9:26:16 PM

On 3/12/2009 The good Dr wrote:
>Personally I either shorten or retire ropes with flat spots in them.

Probably good advise.

BUT.

Given what I paid for it and limited use so far (30m if that) i'd really not like to chop 10m off it just yet.

Mike Bee

4-Dec-2009
12:01:40 AM

Out of curiosity, what brand and model are the rope?

The good Dr

4-Dec-2009
7:10:12 AM

On 3/12/2009 climber72 wrote:
>On 3/12/2009 The good Dr wrote:
>>Personally I either shorten or retire ropes with flat spots in them.
>
>Probably good advise.
>
>BUT.
>
>Given what I paid for it and limited use so far (30m if that) i'd really
>not like to chop 10m off it just yet.

It is not about the amount of use the rope has had but the damage it has received. Put it this way, if you bought a car, drove it 200m and the brakes suddenly stopped working, you wouldn't have the same attitude. The rope is one of your primary safety devices, treat it like that.

rockranga

4-Dec-2009
8:54:42 AM

If you're having no luck with the manufacturer take it back to where you bought it, show them the rope is defective and get them to replace it. Then the dealer can take it up with the manufacturer.

I'm not a lowyer so i could be wrong, but i'm sure there's some consumer protection law saying that a shop ower has a duty of care to ensure the products they are selling are not defective (to a reasonable extent).

The dealer has a relationship with the manufacturer so make it there problem, not yours.

climbau

4-Dec-2009
9:54:21 AM

To make the best possible argument you should write an emotionless and specific letter/email that
documents the amount of work the rope has done, the conditions in which the rope was used, the
purchase date, the knots used, and the belay devices used. The manufacturer/distributor will then be
able to inspect the rope and treat the issue with the respect it deserves.
Try to pre-empt the questions a manufacturer would ask, even the dumb ones. And remember, questions
asked of you may seem dumb or insulting but they are generally important in determining the knowledge
and expertise of the user. Be honest and calm, as even a case of misuse may get you enough sympathy
for a new rope?
Good Luck.

ajfclark

4-Dec-2009
10:01:27 AM

On 4/12/2009 rockranga wrote:
>I'm not a lowyer so i could be wrong, but i'm sure there's some consumer protection law saying that a shop ower has a duty of care to ensure the products they are selling are not defective (to a reasonable extent).

I'm pretty sure they have to be fit for purpose too.

climber72

4-Dec-2009
4:38:22 PM

On 4/12/2009 climbau wrote:
>To make the best possible argument you should write an emotionless and specific letter/email

I emailed them straight away, included details of the routes we climbed, lower off set up, knots involved and hardware used. As mentioned previously I have not received a reply as yet.

looks like the best option will be to take it back to the place of purchase and see what the attitude is there.

I wont detail the specifics of the rope just yet Mike Bee but it is produced by a market leader from the U.S.A. and described as one of the best all round ropes available.

Hopefully I can get some safety feedback from the source, then I can decide to chop it or not.

Problem is it will most likely flatten in spots along the whole 60m when we have to rap down it!!

Thanks for feedback.

Robb

4-Dec-2009
5:19:06 PM

I won a new rope a while back and after week in tassie it had some noticeable flat spots. I felt a bit bad since I had won the rope anyway but sent it back to the importer and they gave me a new one. awesome.

onsight

4-Dec-2009
7:06:43 PM

You should definitely take it back to the place you purchased it from, that's who your dealings are with. If it's obvious it's a new rope then there is a good chance they will exchange it. It's then for them to sort it out with the distributor/importer/manufacturer. Without seeing it I'd suspect it's unlikely strength is compromised but it's going to be a pain to use/handle and probably won't wear evenly. I've seen some for the best brands on occasion have sheaths that are too loose or twisted. It obviously doesn't sound "right" though. So, without knowing the full story, I don't think you'd have too much trouble exchanging it.

Mike Bee

4-Dec-2009
9:04:22 PM

On 4/12/2009 Robb wrote:
>I won a new rope a while back and after week in tassie it had some noticeable
>flat spots. I felt a bit bad since I had won the rope anyway but sent it
>back to the importer and they gave me a new one. awesome.

Did you continue to use the new one Robb? Has that had a similar problem?

Robb

4-Dec-2009
9:51:45 PM

new one has been great. i do tend to hammer my ropes too. its holding up well. no flat spots.
eventually ropes will get flat spots as they get older but pretty sure it wouldnt compromise them to the
point of failure.
But yeah definitely take it back to where you bought it from.

There are 16 messages in this topic.