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Chockstone Forum - Trip Reports

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Topic Date User
TR - Thumbs Out 15-Apr-2013 At 1:48:46 PM PThomson
Message
The fact is, that I HAVE rapped down "thumbs out", and I wouldn't call it a trad LINE at all. Yes, PART of it goes easily on gear. Another part goes dangerously on gear. And the final part is just death on gear. The alternative is that the route stops before the logical conclusion (presumably at some anchor point part way up the wall when the gear runs out), which in itself is not really in line with trad ethics.

To the same extent that one can argue for or against bolting (or more specifically, showing discrimination with respect to WHEN to bolt), the same can be said for trad lines. There are lines that MIGHT go on trad, but that doesn't necessarily mean they SHOULD go on trad. To have a trad climb which either stops before any logical conclusion, or becomes an unprotectable death-route merely for the sake of satisfying someone's ego is about as anti-ethical as you can get (and very much in line with bolting where not necessary).

I like to use Birds Nest at Mt York as an example. Theoretically its a gear route, but the reality is that it's a free solo because the gear is so rubbish you might as well just leave it at the base of the climb. The climbing, however, is brilliant for the grade. Consequently, you have a line that could (theoretically) be done on gear, and WAS done on gear, but perhaps SHOULDN'T have been (though the argument is moot now, as it would be obscene to retrobolt it), because short of 20,000 newbies climbing it on top rope, it doesn't really get done by climbers who could really appreciate a climb at that grade on lead.

Nick Clow:

In response to your previous post (addressing the first 2 of your .dot points):

1. The routes at the right hand end of the crag are actually extremely popular, and have cleaned up quite nicely. Its also one of only 2 crags in the blue mountains where you can slab/face climb regardless of how wet it is. If anything, there's only 1 line there which I think is a bit of a squeeze job, I'd call the others very worthwhile.

2. Considering your comments about indiscriminate lines, it seems kind of strange that you would make this post. If anything, it could be argued that it's discriminate to place the anchors where the good climbing on the route itself ends before turning into either a pointless rope-ripping doddle, or at the other end of the spectrum to a disordinately hard pitch that is out of context with the rest of the climb. The history of climbing in the Blue Mountains and across Australia, for that matter, has routes following exactly this principle, many of which are regarded as megaclassics today.

Regards,

-Paul

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