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Australian Ethics

8:49:26 PM
See Ben Lomond thread for description of Australian Ethics.

Fully bolted "Sport Routes" are something that is relatively new to Australian climbing.

If, for example, you go to a crag and repeat a fully bolted route but place runners making some or all the bolts redundant, should the said bolt/s be chopped?

I believe they should and we should get back to our own ethics instead of following other countries weak example.

9:11:49 PM
Australian Ethic: Bolts, Don't wack em' in and if you pull em' out do it neatly otherwise clip the fcukers.

9:12:04 PM
if you wanna climb something without bolts then so be it, if its a sport route then you climbing it without bolts doesnt change that. some of the routes ive put up were first done as solos (i was skipping school and didnt have a belayer!) then i came back and bolted them later

if the bolts shouldnt have been put there in the first place (whether due to local ethic or the availability of other gear) then rip the f---ers out

and just quietly, i think fully bolted sport routes have been around for a few years...
9:14:01 PM
Trollus Maximus. As he said, see the Ben Lomond thread.

9:23:48 PM
On 16/04/2007 kieranl wrote:
>Trollus Maximus. As he said, see the Ben Lomond thread.

Thanks for your positive input into the discussion, kieranl.

Fail to see anything trowlish in either post, this is a continuation of a discussion I had with a few people a little while ago (in real life, not this faceless interweb stuff). There are a number of people out there who are seriously considering this option.

10:24:39 PM
This sounds too much like people wanting to retro bolt something that is too run out so is this idea "retro unbolting" definently sucks though a sport route is just that if you can lead it on natural gear woop de do go for it but dont stuff up others hard work.

10:29:02 PM
if you can lead a climb sensibly on natural gear then there shouldnt be bolts in there, so f--- their hard work. and if the local ethic is 'bold over bolt' then you dont even need to consider what is 'sensible' gear just leave it for those who enjoy the odd shattered tibia

10:33:14 PM
aahhh there we go the old sensibly thing so is thats yours mine or someone elses

10:33:58 PM
Thanks Mousey,said well.
10:44:27 PM
Pardon me if I choke. I thought your attitude in the two threads was contradictory.
This comment in the Ben Lomond thread appears to be rubbishing the "no fixed protection area" concept:
>16/04/2007 n00bpwn3r wrote:
>>Simplistically yes, however the notion of a no fixed protection area is
>>both alien and intrusive to "Traditional" Australian ethics.

and in this thread you are supporting the "no fixed protection" ethic. Hence (to me) you are trolling.
I don't have a clue who you really are so you have the advantage of me. I can just go on what you post.
I don't actually have a problem with the "no fixed protection area" concept, we tried to introduce that concept in the Victoria Range about thirty years ago but it didn't get very far (so I'm not unfamiliar with the concept).
If you look back through this thread you will see that I have contempt for people who choose to remain anonymous. If you want to be taken seriously be prepared to identify yourself. I don't actually expect that you'll accede to that request.
You appear to using your anonymity to play games. Maybe I've just misinterpreted the Ben Lomond post, but only you can tell me what it really means.
I'd be happy if you emailed me to set the record straight (using a real identity)

dave h.
10:50:38 PM
I second Kieran's comments. I'd like to put a name to n00bpwn3r....

I mean really... l33t speak on chockstone!?!!?
(edit: corrected typo)

10:52:09 PM
kieranl ,dont feel alone,i thought the exact same thing.

11:09:02 PM
Point 1:Please read both posts again slowly and carefully, I'll think you'll find that at no time did I contradict myself. If you however would like to continue being condescending in the tone of your posts then I am more than happy to belittle you in a similar fashion.
Point 2:kieranl, how would I know you, if I knew your name or not. I could or may have walked past you at the crag, so there for you are just as anonymous to me as I to you.

I don't know you there for your post is worthless is a lame argument, surely a relevant post is just that.

If you look at my profile you'll see my name. You would have to be a Net n00b to supply a ISP generated email address on a public forum, as anybody can create an account and farm personal details. I do believe this site has been hacked before and personal details stolen. As the name implies n00bpwn3r, not n00b.

dave h.
11:16:37 PM
Noob, as I suspect you're well aware, it's not about your listed email address.

It's about attaching your name (or enough of it to identify you) to your remarks, and standing behind your comments. I wonder how many "Matty-boy"s there are out there, but quite frankly who cares.

If you want to be taken seriously identify yourself.

If you want to troll, or to argue pointlessly, then go to or rec.climbing... Leave the Chockstone Forum for good stuff!
11:20:19 PM
On 16/04/2007 n00bpwn3r wrote:
>kieranl, how would I know you, if I knew your name or not.

I was going to write a long response to this, but what it boils down to is this: use your real name and stand behind what you say or gtfo.


11:26:00 PM
Sorry Duncan, I have no idea who you are so your opinion is worthless.

11:26:48 PM
ahhhh, just like the good ole' days ey lads! nothing like a trip down memory lane.......

11:31:44 PM
n00bpwn3r-youve eluded the actual debate,Have not confirmed wether you do or have actually climed traditionally and still lack depth and now your using sarcasum.

I cant compete with that.Theres more to life.

11:36:47 PM
If it makes any difference, I've climbed routes with all natural gear, routes with bolts and gear and routes all on bolts with lower offs.

Not sure if that helps. I climb all types off stuff.

dave h.
11:36:58 PM
n00bpwn3r - Thanks for the PMs. Onya for putting your real name on your profile.

I'm retiring from this discussion due to a uni assignment due tomorrow that I need to start...

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There are 83 messages in this topic.


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