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General Climbing Discussion

Author

Basic advise needed

Dino8943

14-Jul-2004
12:06:48 PM

hello!

Im an amateur photographer and Im looking for a simple method to climb trees with the least amount of equipment as possible. My problem is most of the trees around where I live have no branches untill 15-30ft up. I've considered using spikes but it seems like it would do alot of damage to the tree.. so Im left with using a rope.

I have NO experience with climbing, but I am well aware of the risks involved. So please dont be frightened away with giving a beginner advice.. I will not use any information without being 100% positive I can use it correctly and safely.

With that said..

One of the techniques that seems well suited for my needs is using two Pruisk knots as described here:

http://www.chockstone.org/TechTips/AscendRope.htm

Does anyone have any personal experiences using this method? Pros, Cons?

For equipment, let me list what I intend to use
Sit body Harness
50Ft of climbing rope
a short length of 6-7mm rope (for the harness and foot pruisk knots)
a few caribiners

anything else I should condider?

Is it absolutely neccesary to use a slip knot for the foot support? It seems to me that it would get very tight on you foot and be a hassle getting it off?

I know its a lot of questions, but I'd really appreaciate some help in doing this safely.

thanks
-Dean


phil box

14-Jul-2004
12:17:43 PM

The basic advice I can give you is to go and get some professional instruction. This is not the place for you to learn what you require.


Mike

14-Jul-2004
12:54:02 PM

I agree with Phil. Please get someone experienced to show you in person. Do not trust your life to something you've read on the internet! And this is coming from the person who wrote the article you linked above. Prusiking up a rope is an essential, but advanced technique. Just about any experienced climber will be able to demonstrate it to you so you shouldn't have trouble finding help, but as Phil says, get professional instruction!

I'd just hate to hear you'd done something silly for want of learning properly. Like maybe clipping your backup figure 8 knots to a non-load bearing part of your harness such as the gear loops. Gear loops will hold 5kg if that. Or maybe you use a slippery new rope and too few wraps with the prusik resulting in the thing not gripping. Or you don't tie/seat it well and it slides down, heats up and burns through. Or the knot jams while you're halfway up. Prusiks are renowned for jamming so tight you can't shift them. What are you going to do then? Scream for help? Plus once you're up how do you intend to get down? Abseil for the first time with no backup and no knowledge of properly anchoring yourself? Down prusik the rope? This is harder than going up. On dynamic climbing rope (as opposed to static) you'll be bouncing all over the shop, what if you knock your head on a branch? You're scaring the hell out me the more I think about it!


shmalec

14-Jul-2004
1:11:42 PM

yeh...if you're not a climber you shouldn't try this one without assistance.

there are other, better techniques for climbing trees than the standard climber's prussiking method. the gear is slightly different too. diff rope, thicker prussiks so you can descend with them more easily and different harness.

try some arbour/tree lopping type resources/courses.

basically you tie one end to your harness, chuck the other end over a branch and hook it into your harness with a prussic. With some good technique and a bit of hip thrusting you can haul yourself up, shifting the prussic up as you go.


Mike

14-Jul-2004
1:23:27 PM

On 14/07/2004 shmalec wrote:
>basically you tie one end to your harness, chuck the other end over a
>branch and hook it into your harness with a prussic. With some good technique
>and a bit of hip thrusting you can haul yourself up, shifting the prussic
>up as you go.

Rope shaving over the branch, life dependant on a single prusik knot... these tree climbers are crazy ;-)


maxots

14-Jul-2004
2:11:05 PM

apparetnly it pays well, im thinking of doing work expereince with an company next term, or better yet with a skyscraper window cleaning company !!!

has anyone doen any of this wrok, apparently it pays well ( and as climbers we should have almost all the rope skills, with some adaptions.

???????? well any stories ? ? ?? ?

Dino8943

14-Jul-2004
2:12:40 PM

I realize very well the dangers invloved here, thats why my plan is to understand and test this out before Im in a dangerous situation.

Mike- thanks for those possible scenarios, definitly an eye opener, Im not about to run out and try this tommorrow so dont worry ( ; As far as getting down.. my firt choice was a parachute.. what do you think?
lol, Im not going to learn how to rapel for the first time from a 60 foot tree! You must get alot of crazy people through here to think such a thing.

Mainly just testing everything out and being comfortable in using it before hand, I think will be the way to go. Gettin instructions isnt really an option I've considered, the closest place is about 2 hours away and paying for something I can learn on my own dosent apeal to me either.

thanks for the help!


Rich

14-Jul-2004
2:34:25 PM

On 14/07/2004 Dino8943 wrote:

>Is it absolutely neccesary to use a slip knot for the foot support? It
>seems to me that it would get very tight on you foot and be a hassle getting
>it off?

**insert disclaimer here**
yes it could get tight, you could use an overhand knot to form a loop or a sling connected to the prussik.
also i prefer using a french prusik on the top prusik (connected to harness) so it doesn't jam up..

yeh as shmalec said a tree climbing site with a discussion which would be more useful try this: http://www.isa-arbor.com/discussion/discussion.asp
good luck
rich

deadpoint

14-Jul-2004
3:26:48 PM

Ladder


Rich

14-Jul-2004
4:05:02 PM

yeh i was gonna say that... a caving ladder would be pretty handy there.


phil box

14-Jul-2004
4:14:10 PM

for anyone wishing to get into industrial ropes rigging i/e window cleaning I would highly recommend the courses that are available through SRTE. The mans name is Andrew Rogalia and he runs a company called funnily enough "International Rescue". Andrew is the son of the founder of the company that makes that wonderful gear SRTE. I cannot speak highly enough of the man.

His collection of tested gear is an eye opener. He gets to play with the test bench at SRT every second day and has been called numerous times as an expert witness to court cases and coronial inquests into the causes of industrial rope accidents. Some of his stories will make your hair curl. For instance how about the window washer who abseils over the side of a parapet wall using one 25kg weight block as his anchor. True story, all he was relying on was the weight of the block plus the friction of the two edges of the parapet wall he was abseiling over.

Andrew was able to convince him to add another 25kg block to the setup but even that was under protest from that potential darwin award recipient.


nmonteith

14-Jul-2004
6:46:24 PM

On 14/07/2004 maxots wrote:
>apparetnly it pays well, im thinking of doing work expereince with an company
>next term, or better yet with a skyscraper window cleaning company !!!
>

I have never done any work myself but I have friends that have. The so called 'glamour' or working as a skyscraper window cleaner wears off very quickly when you discover you are washing off thick carbon buildup from inner-city traffic. Apparently it is very un-pleasant.


mousey

14-Jul-2004
11:19:58 PM

On 14/07/2004 maxots wrote:
>apparetnly it pays well, im thinking of doing work expereince with an company
>next term, or better yet with a skyscraper window cleaning company !!!
>
>has anyone doen any of this wrok, apparently it pays well ( and as climbers
>we should have almost all the rope skills, with some adaptions.
>
>
>???????? well any stories ? ? ?? ?

no sorry no stories...just a comment that tree climbing (for lopping etc.) is a great job for climbers...i have a mate (19 yrs old and no serious qualifications) who gets $500 a day for doing not much more than prussicking and chainsawing a few branches...

john in spain

15-Jul-2004
7:58:11 AM

well my tree hugging/climbing freind one peice of kit that may save your life is a special suit that jams the chainsaw if it hits it an not cut you to peices
an second you could use hand jammers or asenders insted of knots chat to you some more soon got to go out


mousey

15-Jul-2004
8:44:45 AM

yeh though when you're starting out, the $140ish or more that you'll shell out for jumars is a bit overkill when prussick loops cost about $1.50 each. that suit does sound like a sweet idea, but id rather just not let the chainsaw hit my leg....


Rich

15-Jul-2004
8:56:28 AM

..does the suit cover your head?


shaggy

15-Jul-2004
10:54:58 AM

That 'suit' is a pair of kevlar overalls, very expensive, but very expensive. Some of the motorcycle stunt riders wear them when theyre getting dragged along the road at 100km/h, very effective on chainsaw teeth.

As for climbing trees, contact FOE (freinds of the earth), or wilderness society, or Future rescue, they run tree climbing courses for protesters etc...


Rich

15-Jul-2004
11:53:30 AM

On 15/07/2004 shaggy wrote:
>That 'suit' is a pair of kevlar overalls, very expensive, but very expensive.

..sounds expensive


shmalec

15-Jul-2004
12:28:21 PM

chainsaw + rope + tree + person + wind = scary.

the suits are something like a dozen layers of kevlar cloth that clog up and slow down the chain. pretty clever really.

15-Jul-2004
1:49:59 PM

true story

A friend of mines dad was cutting a high branch of a tree with a chain saw. He put the ladder against the branch and proceeded to cut the branch off. Unfortunately he cut the branch on the tree side of the ladder. Down came the branch, chainsaw and my friends dad. he didnt die so its funny.

Another friends dad suffered serious face injuries when the chain came off his chainsaw. Unlike the first dad i think he knew what he was doing.

i have worked in trees with ropes, ladders and chainsaws. Its pretty scary. Chainsaws are really dangerous on solid ground never mind up a tree. there is a reason guys doing this sort of work get paid alot; its dangerous.

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